Do you think he is poor mostly due to bad luck or due to poor life choices? Obviously, it's both, but which do you think has contributed most to his misery?
I have to defend Donald. I don't think he is that lazy, he just lacks ambition. Also, he is still young (I believe he is in his late 20s in most of the stories) and most young people are still somewhat poor. As for his bad luck, yes it is often highlighted how unlucky he is in stories involving Gladstone, but when Gladstone is not around Donald does not seem that unlucky to me.
Third choice: he's a single parent of three in a country without a social safety net, and his fabulously rich uncle is no help. Anyone in that situation would be constantly financially stressed unless they had some inherited wealth. His own parents died too young to build up any equity. (That's true even if, as in my headcanon, they lived until D&D were in their late teens or early 20's.)
I agree with caballero that Donald is not singularly unlucky in comparison to the average person.
In many stories, it appears that Donald constantly undermines himself in work situations due to a couple of factors: his temper, and his "brittle mastery" overconfidence. I was surprised when I found out from European fans on the forum that in Egmont stories Donald has had relatively steady employment at the margarine factory. Oh, I thought, *that's* why there's a margarine factory on one of my Duckburg maps from Europe! In my mind, Donald never held onto any job for long. But not because he's lazy; Gus Goose is lazy, not Donald.
I take issue with the idea that Donald typically lives in "misery"--maybe Rosa's Donald in some later stories, but not Barks' Donald or the Donald presented by most other creators. "Recurring bouts of frustration" might be a better description; he sometimes gripes about wanting to be more wealthy, more famous, or more successful than he is, but he is also often shown as being contented with his lot; it's certainly a running theme in Barks that he wants no part of Scrooge's efforts to drag him into the business world, and that he much prefers a tall, fizzy soda.
In Dutch stories, Donald isn't exactly poor, but he does live from month to month. Why? He doesn't have steady employment, his uncle pays him starvation wages, he causes damage to public property on regular occasions, he has three mouths to feed, he's dating Daisy Duck, and he tends towards rash or careless behavior at the worst possible moments.
Funny enough, early readers in the Netherlands though of Donald as a wealthy man! Why, you ask? Because Barks portrayed him with a fully stuffed fridge, the ability to pay for holidays, and other luxuries that were not afforded to the average Dutch family in those years of post-war austerity! Donald only really became middle class by the 1970s, once the Dutch themselves had caught up to that standard of luxury.
I'd say the main reasons are the fact that he's a single parent, lives in a fairly big house, and that he can't seem to keep his jobs for very long. But that's not for a lack of trying. There's also the fact that he probably takes weeks or even months off from work whenever he goes on adventures with Scrooge... and in return, he gets paid 30 cents an hour. So I guess bad life choices are part of it too.
I think this poll is flawed, because it assumes that there are only 2 possible "primary" reasons why Donald is "poor". It leaves no option for someone who believes that Donald is only poor for specific short interludes in his life, and the causes of that poverty are more than one, and can occur separately, or as a combination of factors. A better poll would, AT THE VERY LEAST, also have an "Other" category, with a "please explain" directive.
Personally, I believe that Donald and his nephews generally live a slightly lower than average "Middle Class" life, with sporadic day-to-day short periods of necessary frugality, due to his being out of a job. He often has to turn to his rich uncle to bail him out of bad financial situations, and always can count on that help, though it comes at a high price of having to live under his uncle's thumb, because of the high interest rate he charges for loans, and the fact that Donald NEVER is able to pay them off.
There are several reasons why Donald is in this predicament. He didn't pay much attention to his studies in high school because of sports and his hormones, and possibly a feeling of helplessness, in attempting to compete with his super-lucky cousin, and the high achievers, who had had the benefit of clear minds,and help from parents, and his energies were also occupied by trying to compete with the much more athletic sports players for the attention of the young women. He had chosen no direction for an eventual career. Despite his parents both having attended university, and even graduate school (which was only done by the educated elite in USA during the 1940s), he apparently got little direction for getting a solid advanced education, and developing a career plan from his parents, and got no advice or help in trying to find a career that would fit his talents. Even if he HAD grown calmer, and more responsible in his young adulthood, he couldn't have attended university, or a regular hours trade school, because he was saddled with the job of being a custodian "foster parent" of his 3 young nephews.
He is periodically lazy for short periods. But he also often has a lot of energy and entrepeneurial inspiration when he gets an idea of how he can bring help to the people by providing a service that they need, that isn't being done then in a given place, or when he finds a job opening in an area that suddenly seems interesting to him. So, laziness is only part of the problem, and THAT, combined with the safety net of always being able to live off his Uncle when he is desperate, or needs a mental rest between his last job failure or business disaster and his next one, keeps the periodic frugal periods occurring. His job and business failures happen because he thinks he knows things when he really doesn't, and his stubbornness and fragile ego keeps getting him into trouble, making mistakes that lead to disasters, and not asking for help from those who no more than he, and/or not "studying" his work aspects and situations. so beforehand, in order to make prudent decision. The disasters are usually so heinous and calamitous that he can't dare try to work in that field for many years (or ever again). So, he needs to calm his rattled nerves for a few months, and to slowly gather up enough courage and moxey to quit his demeaning and menial work for his uncle, and gather enough energy towards a new, brilliant idea for bringing his talents to the people, or enough time for another great job opportunity to unexpectedly "make itself known to him" (e.g. fall out of the sky).
So, the above describes Donald's ongoing complex life and career/employment situation, indicating that like the stuation for many (or most) real people, there is a complex web of factors leading to their career paths and financial situation.
I think this poll is flawed, because it assumes that there are only 2 possible "primary" reasons why Donald is "poor". It leaves no option for someone who believes that Donald is only poor for specific short interludes in his life, and the causes of that poverty are more than one, and can occur separately, or as a combination of factors. A better poll would, AT THE VERY LEAST, also have an "Other" category, with a "please explain" directive.
Personally, I believe that Donald and his nephews generally live a slightly lower than average "Middle Class" life, with sporadic day-to-day short periods of necessary frugality, due to his being out of a job. He often has to turn to his rich uncle to bail him out of bad financial situations, and always can count on that help, though it comes at a high price of having to live under his uncle's thumb, because of the high interest rate he charges for loans, and the fact that Donald NEVER is able to pay them off.
There are several reasons why Donald is in this predicament. He didn't pay much attention to his studies in high school because of sports and his hormones, and possibly a feeling of helplessness, in attempting to compete with his super-lucky cousin, and the high achievers, who had had the benefit of clear minds,and help from parents, and his energies were also occupied by trying to compete with the much more athletic sports players for the attention of the young women. He had chosen no direction for an eventual career. Despite his parents both having attended university, and even graduate school (which was only done by the educated elite in USA during the 1940s), he apparently got little direction for getting a solid advanced education, and developing a career plan from his parents, and got no advice or help in trying to find a career that would fit his talents. Even if he HAD grown calmer, and more responsible in his young adulthood, he couldn't have attended university, or a regular hours trade school, because he was saddled with the job of being a custodian "foster parent" of his 3 young nephews.
He is periodically lazy for short periods. But he also often has a lot of energy and entrepeneurial inspiration when he gets an idea of how he can bring help to the people by providing a service that they need, that isn't being done then in a given place, or when he finds a job opening in an area that suddenly seems interesting to him. So, laziness is only part of the problem, and THAT, combined with the safety net of always being able to live off his Uncle when he is desperate, or needs a mental rest between his last job failure or business disaster and his next one, keeps the periodic frugal periods occurring. His job and business failures happen because he thinks he knows things when he really doesn't, and his stubbornness and fragile ego keeps getting him into trouble, making mistakes that lead to disasters, and not asking for help from those who no more than he, and/or not "studying" his work aspects and situations. so beforehand, in order to make prudent decision. The disasters are usually so heinous and calamitous that he can't dare try to work in that field for many years (or ever again). So, he needs to calm his rattled nerves for a few months, and to slowly gather up enough courage and moxey to quit his demeaning and menial work for his uncle, and gather enough energy towards a new, brilliant idea for bringing his talents to the people, or enough time for another great job opportunity to unexpectedly "make itself known to him" (e.g. fall out of the sky).
So, the above describes Donald's ongoing complex life and career/employment situation, indicating that like the stuation for many (or most) real people, there is a complex web of factors leading to their career paths and financial situation.
I think this poll is flawed, because it assumes that there are only 2 possible "primary" reasons why Donald is "poor". It leaves no option for someone who believes that Donald is only poor for specific short interludes in his life, and the causes of that poverty are more than one, and can occur separately, or as a combination of factors. A better poll would, AT THE VERY LEAST, also have an "Other" category, with a "please explain" directive.
Personally, I believe that Donald and his nephews generally live a slightly lower than average "Middle Class" life, with sporadic day-to-day short periods of necessary frugality, due to his being out of a job. He often has to turn to his rich uncle to bail him out of bad financial situations, and always can count on that help, though it comes at a high price of having to live under his uncle's thumb, because of the high interest rate he charges for loans, and the fact that Donald NEVER is able to pay them off.
There are several reasons why Donald is in this predicament. He didn't pay much attention to his studies in high school because of sports and his hormones, and possibly a feeling of helplessness, in attempting to compete with his super-lucky cousin, and the high achievers, who had had the benefit of clear minds,and help from parents, and his energies were also occupied by trying to compete with the much more athletic sports players for the attention of the young women. He had chosen no direction for an eventual career. Despite his parents both having attended university, and even graduate school (which was only done by the educated elite in USA during the 1940s), he apparently got little direction for getting a solid advanced education, and developing a career plan from his parents, and got no advice or help in trying to find a career that would fit his talents. Even if he HAD grown calmer, and more responsible in his young adulthood, he couldn't have attended university, or a regular hours trade school, because he was saddled with the job of being a custodian "foster parent" of his 3 young nephews.
He is periodically lazy for short periods. But he also often has a lot of energy and entrepeneurial inspiration when he gets an idea of how he can bring help to the people by providing a service that they need, that isn't being done then in a given place, or when he finds a job opening in an area that suddenly seems interesting to him. So, laziness is only part of the problem, and THAT, combined with the safety net of always being able to live off his Uncle when he is desperate, or needs a mental rest between his last job failure or business disaster and his next one, keeps the periodic frugal periods occurring. His job and business failures happen because he thinks he knows things when he really doesn't, and his stubbornness and fragile ego keeps getting him into trouble, making mistakes that lead to disasters, and not asking for help from those who no more than he, and/or not "studying" his work aspects and situations. so beforehand, in order to make prudent decision. The disasters are usually so heinous and calamitous that he can't dare try to work in that field for many years (or ever again). So, he needs to calm his rattled nerves for a few months, and to slowly gather up enough courage and moxey to quit his demeaning and menial work for his uncle, and gather enough energy towards a new, brilliant idea for bringing his talents to the people, or enough time for another great job opportunity to unexpectedly "make itself known to him" (e.g. fall out of the sky).
So, the above describes Donald's ongoing complex life and career/employment situation, indicating that like the stuation for many (or most) real people, there is a complex web of factors leading to their career paths and financial situation.
I added an 'Other' option.
You might also add the following choices:
(1)"Stubborn"; (2)"Ego-driven", (3)"Hormone-driven", (4)"All of The Above", and (5)"A combination of factors and psychological problems that would drive a psychiatrist to seek psychoanalysis for himself for agreeing to attempt to asses Donald's case".
The somewhat less “in-universe” answer is that Donald is the average Joe trying to make ends meet so that viewers/readers will sympathize with him as an “Everyman” character, like many other characters in comics, animation and sitcoms. In the stories, Donald’s lot in life is often a combination of poor decisions combined with bad luck.
The somewhat less “in-universe” answer is that Donald is the average Joe trying to make ends meet so that viewers/readers will sympathize with him as an “Everyman” character, like many other characters in comics, animation and sitcoms. In the stories, Donald’s lot in life is often a combination of poor decisions combined with bad luck.
Yes, it is nice that it isn't ALWAYS his own fault that he's in a mess, because then we wouldn't love him as a protagonist. On the other hand it's nice that it isn't ALWAYS that he has bad luck, because then we would only feel sorry for him as a pathetic character, and we could root for such a person to get better luck, but we really couldn't think of him as a hero, who can rise to the occasion to face the difficult situations in life. As a flawless superhero, we couldn't love him, because he wouldn't be a complete, real person, with a fleshed out character, having strong points and weaknesses, too. Barks used an extremely good balance to keep us interested in stories about Donald, because we'd never know until the end of the story if he'd be a hero, a goat, or just a supporter of his nephews, other relative, or a guest character, who was featured in the story, to show something about Donald's character, and with which we readers could identify from our own life experiences.
Post by dorialexander on Mar 21, 2021 19:37:46 GMT
I would rather wonder if Donald is still poor. In the Egmont continuity he usually holds a somewhat steady blue-collar job. There is no such stability in the italian comics but material matters seems to have become much less prevalent in the last 20 or 30 years. Possibly because the character has a gained a lot more self-confidence under his "Duck avenger" identity, it's not even unfrequent to see him actually win some good money. One of the most successful italian duck series at the moment is even centered on a very rich alter ego of Donal/Duck Avenger, Fantomius. Financial issues still occur occasionally in the Donald & Fethry comic stories but it is usually implied it is a different continuity (possibly with a younger Donald).
Last Edit: Mar 21, 2021 19:44:40 GMT by dorialexander
One of the most successful italian duck series at the moment is even centered on a very rich alter ego of Donal/Duck Avenger, Fantomius.
Well, dorialexander, actually Fantomius is not an alter ego of Donald/Duck Avenger, he's a COMPLETELY DIFFERENT character, not attached to Donald in any way.
His real name is Lord Quackett, he's a rich dark-haired (!) duck living in a victorian Duckburg by the turn of the 20th century and through the very first decades of it.
He's not "yet another alter ego" of Donald, matter of fact he meets Donald in some stories -A couple for sure, I don't know if more. INDUCKS lists Lord Quackett appearing in 6 stories with Donald, and Fantomius in 18!-.
Post by Monkey_Feyerabend on Mar 22, 2021 8:47:42 GMT
I would also object on the use of the word 'poverty'. In no interpretation of the character, in cartoons or comics, Donald is poor. Sometimes he appears unemployed - as I am right now - and late with a few bill payments, but generally speaking he lives a middle class life. That's not poverty. As most of the world goes, that's the opposite of poverty.
he's a single parent of three in a country without a social safety net,
Literally every English-language Disney comic has Duckburg as a part of the US, a country build upon the idea of freedom, community and the pursuit of happiness.