The "ultimate" Duck family tree

[Scroogerello]

Great job! I personally don’t like the idea of Gyro, Glomgold, Rockerduck, etc. all being related to the Ducks, but I know there’s some stories that say they are.  
Are you planning to put *every* relative on the tree, or are you making a selection? In case it’s the first, here’s a few missing that I know of:

- Scrooge’s uncle (in the Dutch translation he’s named Schraalhans). He is much stingier than
Scrooge, whom he sees as a terrible spendthrift (which is the same basic characterizations behind Scrooge’s cousins Bruce and Douglas— maybe he’s their dad.)
inducks.org/story.php?c=I+TL+1988-E

- Donald’s old farmer uncle Egbert (probably Humperdink’s brother) from this story:
inducks.org/story.php?c=D++8074&search=Scratchpot

- A very similar looking hilbilly relative from this one—in the Dutch version he’s Donald’s uncle, but if the INDUCKS-description is to be believed, he’s a cousin in the original text.
inducks.org/story.php?c=D++7296

- Daisy has an aunt in this story, who wants to help Daisy find a man (I haven’t read the story myself, but you can see her on the inducks scan): inducks.org/story.php?c=D++9408
She looks like a high-society snob, maybe she’s Bertram’s wife.

- Grandma Duck has two cousins in this story (one male and one female), and the male cousin has a son who is about Donald’s age.
inducks.org/story.php?c=D+2005-317

- Grandma has a cousin (who kinda looked like Katie Mallard from Barks’ Ghosstown Railroad) in a Daniel Branca story. Matilda posted a few scans of her on the forum once. Although, in the story she is Grandma *and* Scrooge’s cousin, so make of that what you will.

- Grandma also has a distant cousin from Finland.
picsou.fandom.com/fr/wiki/Marthe_(cousine_de_Grand-mère_Donald)

- Glomgold has a Texan cousin (I forgot his name again!!) in this story: inducks.org/story.php?c=D+2006-230

There’s a whole bunch of Gyro relatives still;

-an aunt inducks.org/story.php?c=I+TL+2332-2

-and another aunt named Polly from a recent Italian story.

-a niece named Daniela in this Jan Gulbransson story:
inducks.org/story.php?c=G+MM2013-06&search=%20Gulbransson

Finally, Wikipedia says Ludwig has a cousin Victor who appears in “Mickey and the Roadster Racers”, but I wouldn’t blame you for ignoring the TV shows (especially the educational preschool stuff) altogether since they are so completely different from the comics version.
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mickey_Mouse_Mixed-Up_Adventures

[sim]

Apr 11, 2021 14:49:11 GMT Scroogerello said:

Great job! I personally don’t like the idea of Gyro, Glomgold, Rockerduck, etc. all being related to the Ducks, but I know there’s some stories that say they are.  
Are you planning to put *every* relative on the tree, or are you making a selection? In case it’s the first, here’s a few missing that I know of:

- Scrooge’s uncle (in the Dutch translation he’s named Schraalhans). He is much stingier than
Scrooge, whom he sees as a terrible spendthrift (which is the same basic characterizations behind Scrooge’s cousins Bruce and Douglas— maybe he’s their dad.)
inducks.org/story.php?c=I+TL+1988-E

- Donald’s old farmer uncle Egbert (probably Humperdink’s brother) from this story:
inducks.org/story.php?c=D++8074&search=Scratchpot

- A very similar looking hilbilly relative from this one—in the Dutch version he’s Donald’s uncle, but if the INDUCKS-description is to be believed, he’s a cousin in the original text.
inducks.org/story.php?c=D++7296

- Daisy has an aunt in this story, who wants to help Daisy find a man (I haven’t read the story myself, but you can see her on the inducks scan): inducks.org/story.php?c=D++9408
She looks like a high-society snob, maybe she’s Bertram’s wife.

- Grandma Duck has two cousins in this story (one male and one female), and the male cousin has a son who is about Donald’s age.
inducks.org/story.php?c=D+2005-317

- Grandma has a cousin (who kinda looked like Katie Mallard from Barks’ Ghosstown Railroad) in a Daniel Branca story. Matilda posted a few scans of her on the forum once. Although, in the story she is Grandma *and* Scrooge’s cousin, so make of that what you will.

- Grandma also has a distant cousin from Finland.
picsou.fandom.com/fr/wiki/Marthe_(cousine_de_Grand-mère_Donald)

- Glomgold has a Texan cousin (I forgot his name again!!) in this story: inducks.org/story.php?c=D+2006-230

There’s a whole bunch of Gyro relatives still;

-an aunt inducks.org/story.php?c=I+TL+2332-2

-and another aunt named Polly from a recent Italian story.

-a niece named Daniela in this Jan Gulbransson story:
inducks.org/story.php?c=G+MM2013-06&search=%20Gulbransson

Finally, Wikipedia says Ludwig has a cousin Victor who appears in “Mickey and the Roadster Racers”, but I wouldn’t blame you for ignoring the TV shows (especially the educational preschool stuff) altogether since they are so completely different from the comics version.
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mickey_Mouse_Mixed-Up_Adventures

Flintheart's cousin is called Evertti in the Finnish reprint

Donald's uncle Manny appearing here -> www.youtube.com/watch?v=rxMzsXhJwpU
Ludwig's cousin Victor von Goose appearing here -> www.dailymotion.com/video/x6sb4md

[stuftmcduck]

Apr 11, 2021 21:08:23 GMT LP said:

Apr 11, 2021 1:29:12 GMT stuftmcduck said:

I come back essentially on a whim for the first time in a long time due to being in the mood for goofy stuff like Disney comics as the quacking plague winds down, and to my unimaginable delight I find this! You are a worthy successor, nay, SURPASSOR, to Gilles Maurice. You did indeed find some errors, or what I think were errors, in Gilles' tree - I like that you moved Alex Gearloose ahead (he's supposed to be a contemporary of Edison, who stole the idea for the lightbulb from him, yet Gilles' tree had him earlier than Socrates, who was in the pioneer era and thus probably lived around the same time as Cornelius Coot), and you dropped non-marriage romantic relationships; Gilles including those was always odd to me. And is that the scan of the infamous Aunt Audree I found after Gilles himself told me what issue she was in? Touched if so!

I'll be watching this like a hawk (any of those related to Donald?) to see if and how this develops further. Did you make any annotations as to who debuted where and such? Would be honored to see them if so! As for finding new scans, I humbly suggest a couple resources: my own earlier thread in this very forum, "Mystery ducks on the Gilles Maurice family tree," and Gilles' explanatory table from his first version of the tree, which, though gone from his site now, can be viewed with the magic of archive.org: web.archive.org/web/20010907083547/http://goofy313g.free.fr/calisota_online/trees/myducktree.html

Keep me and everyone else here posted!

Fourth of all, yes - you and your thread were indeed very helpful in my making of the tree! So thanks! Maybe you could help me identify the stories that the non-pictured characters in my tree come from? I hope to eventually put a face to each character! (And I'd rather not just copy-paste the cropped images from Gilles' tree!)

I can indeed help you with some of those, thanks to my OCD-fueled hunt for everyone on Gilles' tree. I THINK I've found a story everyone with a picture on his tree, with the help of the lovely people here and even Gilles himself! So, from left to right on the tree, and earliest to latest...

* Joakim McDuck: inducks.org/story.php?c=I+TL++719-C&search= (not completely sure?)
* Timothy Gearloose: inducks.org/s.php?c=B+790036
* Kerababor McDuck: inducks.org/story.php?c=D++5920&search=
* Klazien Gadwall and the Trouwharts: inducks.org/story.php?c=H+21178&search=
* Penael Bung: inducks.org/story.php?c=B+790131&search=
* Mick McMerganser & lady friend: inducks.org/story.php?c=D++7156&search=McMerganser (also not totally sure)
* Florian de Canard: inducks.org/story.php?c=D+92071&search=
* Paper McDuck, Donald Butler, Gladstone Wilkes, and everyone else who's a duck-ified Gone With the Wind character: inducks.org/story.php?c=I+TL+1396-AP&search=
* Guldbrand, Salomon, Vermund McWildduck: inducks.org/story.php?c=D++6190&search=
* Patatinhas: inducks.org/story.php?c=B+830141&search=
* Arsene McDuck: inducks.org/story.php?c=I+TL++690-A&search=
* Amanda: inducks.org/story.php?c=D++9172&search=
* Kittie Coot: inducks.org/issue.php?c=dk%2FAA1974-41
* Douglas Duck: inducks.org/story.php?c=D++7296
* Angus Duck: inducks.org/story.php?c=D++4947&search=
* Agathe McDuck: inducks.org/story.php?c=D++8082&search=
* Calamity Daisy:https://inducks.org/story.php?c=B+930082&search=
* Darius: inducks.org/story.php?c=D+96055&search=
* Egbert #1: inducks.org/story.php?c=D++8074&search=
* Egbert #2: inducks.org/story.php?c=D+95113&search=
* Smorfio: A story Gilles says has the Inducks code "IP23461," but nothing comes up. Apparently a Christmas special where Donald gets yelled at by him because he hates holidays.
* Andedun Duck: Somewhere in here: inducks.org/issue.php?c=dk%2FAA1971-52
* Andreas Drake: Possibly inducks.org/story.php?c=D++1187
* Wilma McDuck (called Meg on the Inducks): inducks.org/story.php?c=D+10094
* Ian and Jacob: A kids' book called "Donald and the Loch Ness Monster"
* Angus McDuck 1: inducks.org/story.php?c=D++7984&search=
* Angus McDuck 2: inducks.org/story.php?c=D+88149
* Jason McDuck: inducks.org/story.php?c=I+PM++160-4
* Adolphus Mortimer: inducks.org/story.php?c=S+71291&search=treasure%20portrait
* Jack McDuck: inducks.org/story.php?c=D++7296&search=
* Azalea: inducks.org/story.php?c=H+95189&search=
* Jake: inducks.org/story.php?c=I+PK+++22-1
* Fritz: inducks.org/story.php?c=S+63051&search=
* Landy and Molly: inducks.org/story.php?c=S+71377&search=
* Dali Duck: inducks.org/issue.php?c=dk%2FAA1974-21
* Baldwin von Drake: inducks.org/story.php?c=I+TL+1294-A&search=
* Gandy: inducks.org/story.php?c=S+77142&search=
* Dimmy: inducks.org/story.php?c=W+JW++++3-02&search=Dimmy

Eager to see the tree sparkling with scans of these!

[LP]

Apr 17, 2021 19:31:09 GMT Scrooge MacDuck said:

I dunno — it'd seem like a weird coincidence for Gyro to be next to Gretchen specifically if that were so, given that it's such a commonly-held suspicion. Notably, Rockerduck and Gyro are actually on the tree (i.e. within the green), unlike Flintheart and the Beagles. 

Regarding Grote, by the way, it is one thing that you do not retain its own creations (or the Erika Fuchs creations it inserts), but wouldn't you consider using some of its depictions of otherwise-unseen relatives? I am thinking, for example, Eider Coot. 

Thanks for the confirmation re: FamilyEcho. As to why it's like that, the expectation is that it's used for real family trees, and so you'll only share the link with real relatives… I don't know of any better, free family-tree-building software (what did you use, yourself?). 

By the way, just noticed you didn't have Whitewater and Fethry as siblings on this thing. I think that's a losing battle you're fighting here… but alright! 

Well, fair enough. The rules I'm going by with my tree is that there needs to be in-story evidence for a genealogical connection in order for me to include it. The exception is Rosa's tree, since he created those characters specifically to fill those empty spots. It's possible that my rules are inconsistent somewhere, I might have overlooked something.
Has speculation of the Gretchen-Gyro connection been documented before? I mean, other than fans talking on forums, where is this connection coming from? Has there been an article in some Donald-magazine somewhere? 

So, I would say that the major difference between Grote's and Rosa's "place-fillers" is that Grote uses background portraits and appropriates them. That would be fine in theory. However, some of these don't make any sense. Why does a portrait of Gladstone's father's mother's father hang in Donald's house, for example? The decision of which portrait goes with which character seems to have been arbitrarily done, which I guess is the main reason for my hesitation. When I read an old Barks-story and see a portrait of an angry duck on the wall, I'm not thinking "Aaah, yes - that's April, May, and June's father, who is married to Donald's cousin, which is why it hangs here in his house!" because... that's absurd to me.
So yeah, as with most ancillary material, I regard that tree as an unreliable source.

I would hope that FamilyEcho has some sort of option of whether other people can edit the tree or not! In theory, anyone could dismantle the whole tree and let hours of work go to waste! That seems like a design flaw to me.
I use Photoshop. I've made the "templates" myself. I prefer when the whole tree is visible at once, which doesn't appear to be an option with FamilyEcho.

There was a discussion about Fethry's relation to Donald in another thread called something to the effect of "A question about Cornelius Coot". There's a Kinney/Hubbard story where it's stated that Fethry and Donald are distantly related. First cousin isn't distant enough to be ... distant. But Donald also makes it clear that they aren't "distant enough". I chose to interpret this as second cousins. 
Whitewater is stated to be Douglas McDuck's nephew in a few Egmont-stories. In the original Barks-Whitewater-story he was said to be rather distantly related to Donald too (once again, I don't consider first cousin to be very distant). Rosa seemingly ignored these in-story facts when making his tree. I elect to not do that. 
That's the short version. I recommend reading the thread I mentioned for more information! (By the way, that's where you'll find the origin of my Duck tree too!)

[stuftmcduck]

Apr 27, 2021 18:19:42 GMT Scroogerello said:

Joakim McDuck (Duncan Duck in the Dutch translation) is from this Vicar-drawn story.

inducks.org/story.php?c=D+89036

He’s a ghost that guards castle McDuck. Donald and Scrooge meet him when they try to get the valuables from the castle.

Cool stuff, thanks!

I remembered one other relative that's still a mystery though: The portly, pipe-smoking cousin called Jack McDuck. This is a weird one - if you look VERY closely at the old version of Gilles' tree on archive.org, this character is there, but the corresponding description in the table is actually Cousin Douglas, the hillbilly cousin from the story... "Hillbilly Cousin." In the second version, the one that's live now, the correct Douglas is there, with the fat pipe-smoker now called Jack McDuck.

So... any ideas?

[stuftmcduck]

This is just fantastic what we're doing here! With Jack found, in particular, it seems every. Single. Named character from Gilles' tree has been sourced! That leaves only one mystery: the big blob of relatives Gilles portrays as descendants of Hillbilly Cousin Douglas. But are they from the same story? The art style looks more recent to me, suggesting Maurice, as he did and we're doing, found them in a different story but put them there because he felt that's where they fit.

Any ideas?

[sim]

Apr 29, 2021 22:17:20 GMT stuftmcduck said:

This is just fantastic what we're doing here! With Jack found, in particular, it seems every. Single. Named character from Gilles' tree has been sourced! That leaves only one mystery: the big blob of relatives Gilles portrays as descendants of Hillbilly Cousin Douglas. But are they from the same story? The art style looks more recent to me, suggesting Maurice, as he did and we're doing, found them in a different story but put them there because he felt that's where they fit.

Any ideas?

they are from the same story. Cousin Douglas visits Donald and then calls all of his family

[stuftmcduck]

Apr 29, 2021 22:29:24 GMT sim said:

Apr 29, 2021 22:17:20 GMT stuftmcduck said:

This is just fantastic what we're doing here! With Jack found, in particular, it seems every. Single. Named character from Gilles' tree has been sourced! That leaves only one mystery: the big blob of relatives Gilles portrays as descendants of Hillbilly Cousin Douglas. But are they from the same story? The art style looks more recent to me, suggesting Maurice, as he did and we're doing, found them in a different story but put them there because he felt that's where they fit.

Any ideas?

they are from the same story. Cousin Douglas visits Donald and then calls all of his family

THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!

This sounds goofy, but this means a lot to me. I've wanted to know everyone on Gilles' tree since early adolescence, when I was introduced to Life and Times of Scrooge by /co/, back before the -chans were COMPLETELY terrible. Remains one of my favorite comics to this day. Thanks to this thread an almost decade-and-a-half debt has been paid!

[farmspirit]

Another batch of ducks-relative:

- in Paperino e il segreto di "Grattugia" Donald inherits a farm and then a lot of gold from a distant relative called Grattugia (which means grater).

- in Paperino e l'eredità da... brivido a character called Red macPaper becomes an hermit and leaves all his possession to his relatives. At the notay there are Scrooge, Donald, HDL, Grandma Duck, Daisy and Glastone. All of this are only called 'relatives' of Red, except Gladstone who is specified to be nipote(which means both nephew and grandson, so maybe it can be decided if someone would check a translation?).

- in Zio Paperone e l'erede universale there is a lot more. The main find is Alec de' Paperoni, who already is on the tree as Dietbald Duck, but imho in a incorrect position. Is surname de' Paperoni is the italian for "mcDuck", so he should be so, considering that there isn't an ufficial english translation. If you don't want to move him too much, maybe you could place him under Douglas? I don't know him, so I've no idea if it would fit or no.

But the big score from that story is the family tree of Scrooge, shown in the first page. It contains a lot of names. Other than Alec, we see the names of:

Astolfo de' Paperoni, at the base of the trunk;

Goffredo de' Paperoni, in the middle of the trunk;

Olinto, alone in a branch;

Petra, in a branch which continues with other names, so probably has some descendants;

Pepe and Camillo, who share the same branch. Probably siblings, seeing how HDL are later rappresented in the same way;

Edo and Eriprando, possibly siblings for the same reason;

Ciccio and Oliver, potencially siblings. Particularly important this, because Ciccio is the italian name of Gus, so Oliver may be brother of Gus.

All the images are here. Apart from Alec, all the others character are never shown, but only mentioned.

[DuckHistory]

Can't the Withewather situation be solved by having Douglas marry a sister of Lulubelle Loon and thereby also preserve Rosa's tree a bit (I don't know if LP prefers to deviate from it but for me it has always been a handy basis to to hold on to). Douglas would then be Withewather's uncle, and Withewather a sort of cousin to Douglas??? Or is that too far fetched

[Fethryfan]

Oct 5, 2021 7:14:56 GMT DuckHistory said:

Can't the Withewather situation be solved by having Douglas marry a sister of Lulubelle Loon and thereby also preserve Rosa's tree a bit (I don't know if LP prefers to deviate from it but for me it has always been a handy basis to to hold on to). Douglas would then be Withewather's uncle, and Withewather a sort of cousin to Douglas??? Or is that too far fetched

That's a possibility, however LP wants to stay true to Barks' original intent of Whitewater being a distant cousin of Donald, while he is his first cousin in Don Rosa's tree

Personally, i think that Whitewater is both a first cousin and a distant cousin of Donald. He is a first cousin through his father Eider Duck and a distant cousin through her mother Lulubelle Loon, who i believe is related to the clan McDuck. Douglas, being Lulubelle's cousin, would also be Whitewater's distant uncle. This is a conciliation between Barks' and Rosa's statements, while also adding Douglas to the mix. 

I would have no problem in moving Whitewater from Eider's family to place him solely on the McDuck branch like LP did, but Rosa's tree has been acknowledged by so many official sources (Ducktales, Legend of the three Caballeros, The Little Big Book of Disney) that i think that trying to change it is kind of a lost battle

Also...Don Rosa's tree appears in a story (The Duck who never was) so it's a comic fact, not only something from an outside material. And Whitewater and Fethry are clearly Eider's sons here

link