One important question for the timeline is, did the two World Wars and the Cold War ever take place? Or not? One Finnish dissertation study ("Ankkalinna - portti kahden maailman välillä : Don Rosan Disney-sarjakuvat postmodernina fantasiana" by Katja Kontturi in 2014) claims that the stories of Carl Barks and Don Rosa are set in an alternative universe where these wars have never existed. I find it really obtrusive and I am skeptical about this claim. For example, in Carl Barks' story, "The Icebox Robber," Donald dreams of being involved in a war against the Japanese, and in another Carl Barks' story, "Dangerous Disguise," Donald becomes entangled in patterns of a European spy circle who spying atomic secrets. Instead, direct references to World Wars or political tension are harder to find from Don Rosa’s stories if there are any. But admittedly, I’m not a researcher or doctorate myself, so it’s bad for me to criticize this dissertation research of Kontturi and I might be wrong when I imagine wars are part of this timeline. But if these are part of that postmodern fantasy world of comic stories, then these also affect how the stories settle on the timeline.
It takes some getting in to, finding a foothold that you can confidently base your timeline on. An earlier draft of mine began by following characters 'in-universe', starting with the chapters of The Life and Times of Scrooge McDuck. That works... up to a point.
What I've done now is made a list of all the stories/characters/situations that are referenced in Rosa's comics, just start with the earliest story created. There's about 215 in total, and so far I've done 2: Donald's Nephews (1937/38) and Donald's Cousin Gus (1938/39). Of course, due to time constraints, those stories are now set in the future. I've settled on 1945 personally. 1946 is doable, but it gets a bit crammed with all the seemingly pre-Scrooge holiday tales, especially the Thanksgivings.
I understand that my method of jettisoning Barks stories not implicitly linked to Rosa stories is an unorthodox one, but it does reduce the amount of headaches considerably. For instance, I don't have any Barks comics featuring Jones in my timeline, so I don't have to worry about when he's around or not. That's because I have a rule that states: if someone or something is referenced in more than three Barks stories, that just becomes a background element of Barks' Duckburg. Jones appears five times in Barks, none of which are an explicit 'Jones Origin Story' or directly linked to anything Rosa. So here I stick to Rosa only.
Granted, I don't know where the Ducks live, myself. I haven't gotten to that level of detail, but I will be on the lookout for it from now on.
In my brief time of trying to create a timeline, I hit so many walls that my motivation sort of disappeared. Some problems just can't be solved. To be honest, when making the original post in this thread, I didn't re-read every story as carefully as I should have. That's why I missed the JW in Shacktown. After that, I started re-reading Barks' stories all the way from the beginning. Starting then, I took notes on most every detail. That's when I truly started realizing just how impossible this task is, just how many contradictions we would be dealing with here. One way to deal with that is to just say "all of this happens sometime during 1945-1954" and not think too hard on the actual timeline; another is to do what you have done and remove some stories completely.
For what it's worth, my head-canon timeline has HDL first coming to live with Donald in 1945. When I started re-reading Barks' earliest stories I seriously thought of pushing it back to 1943 or '44... But then I realized that there are far bigger problems in the timeline then that, so I'll stick with '45 for now.
I know Rosa had "1313 Webfoot Walk" on Donald's mailbox at least once. I can't remember which one, though.
I don't care about the timeline as much as i care for continuity to be honest. I just place every story between 1946 and 1955 and that's it. I don't want to discourage you, but i don't think you will have any success trying to find when exactly every story takes place
One important question for the timeline is, did the two World Wars and the Cold War ever take place? Or not? One Finnish dissertation study ("Ankkalinna - portti kahden maailman välillä : Don Rosan Disney-sarjakuvat postmodernina fantasiana" by Katja Kontturi in 2014) claims that the stories of Carl Barks and Don Rosa are set in an alternative universe where these wars have never existed. I find it really obtrusive and I am skeptical about this claim. For example, in Carl Barks' story, "The Icebox Robber," Donald dreams of being involved in a war against the Japanese, and in another Carl Barks' story, "Dangerous Disguise," Donald becomes entangled in patterns of a European spy circle who spying atomic secrets. Instead, direct references to World Wars or political tension are harder to find from Don Rosa’s stories if there are any. But admittedly, I’m not a researcher or doctorate myself, so it’s bad for me to criticize this dissertation research of Kontturi and I might be wrong when I imagine wars are part of this timeline. But if these are part of that postmodern fantasy world of comic stories, then these also affect how the stories settle on the timeline.
The world wars clearly happened as they are mentioned in some stories. I believe Barks' "Search for the Cuspidoria" mentions WW2 but i'm sure right now
Brutopia was a country created by Barks which is a parody of the Soviet Union. So the cold war likely happened as well but probably the real Soviet Union was replaced by Brutopia in this event
One important question for the timeline is, did the two World Wars and the Cold War ever take place? Or not? One Finnish dissertation study ("Ankkalinna - portti kahden maailman välillä : Don Rosan Disney-sarjakuvat postmodernina fantasiana" by Katja Kontturi in 2014) claims that the stories of Carl Barks and Don Rosa are set in an alternative universe where these wars have never existed. I find it really obtrusive and I am skeptical about this claim. For example, in Carl Barks' story, "The Icebox Robber," Donald dreams of being involved in a war against the Japanese, and in another Carl Barks' story, "Dangerous Disguise," Donald becomes entangled in patterns of a European spy circle who spying atomic secrets. Instead, direct references to World Wars or political tension are harder to find from Don Rosa’s stories if there are any. But admittedly, I’m not a researcher or doctorate myself, so it’s bad for me to criticize this dissertation research of Kontturi and I might be wrong when I imagine wars are part of this timeline. But if these are part of that postmodern fantasy world of comic stories, then these also affect how the stories settle on the timeline.
Barks made a 10-page story titled "The Victory Garden," in which Donald tries to grow... well, a victory garden. Such gardens were a way to aid the war effort during WWI and WWII. That's a very clear reference, if you ask me...
I don't care about the timeline as much as i care for continuity to be honest. I just place every story between 1946 and 1955 and that's it. I don't want to discourage you, but i don't think you will have any success trying to find when exactly every story takes place
I agree with your general point. This whole project was mostly an attempt to see if a timeline could be done. Except for Duckfan's earlier work, I'm not sure if anyone has actually attempted to do an actual Barks/Rosa-timeline. Of course, people would say that it's impossible and a waste of time since there would be somewhere around 600 or 700 stories to order with rather few indicators of where they fall in the timeline. I mostly just wanted to see if it really is as impossible as people say. Now I agree with them, and better yet - I have proof of the impossibilities!
Going back to your quote, I think that continuity and the timeline go hand in hand. Continuity means that things happen in the same universe and build on each other. This in turn means that one thing has to happen after the other. Also, if you don't know which order the stories take place in, then you don't know which is the starting point and which is the ending point of a character's character arc.
Barks made a 10-page story titled "The Victory Garden," in which Donald tries to grow... well, a victory garden. Such gardens were a way to aid the war effort during WWI and WWII. That's a very clear reference, if you ask me...
Speaking of victory gardens, how long after the war ended did people continue making victory gardens? I mean, was every garden abandoned as soon as the owner read about Adolf's defeat, or did the gardens continue until the economy stabilized a while later? I'm asking because I think it would be best for my head-canon timeline if HDL came to Donald soon after the war ended. I don't know much about gardening, but I assume you plant your crops some time in the spring. If that's so, is it then possible that The Victory Garden takes place in spring of 1946? Or would that be ridiculous?
I don't care about the timeline as much as i care for continuity to be honest. I just place every story between 1946 and 1955 and that's it. I don't want to discourage you, but i don't think you will have any success trying to find when exactly every story takes place
I agree with your general point. This whole project was mostly an attempt to see if a timeline could be done. Except for Duckfan's earlier work, I'm not sure if anyone has actually attempted to do an actual Barks/Rosa-timeline. Of course, people would say that it's impossible and a waste of time since there would be somewhere around 600 or 700 stories to order with rather few indicators of where they fall in the timeline. I mostly just wanted to see if it really is as impossible as people say. Now I agree with them, and better yet - I have proof of the impossibilities!
Going back to your quote, I think that continuity and the timeline go hand in hand. Continuity means that things happen in the same universe and build on each other. This in turn means that one thing has to happen after the other. Also, if you don't know which order the stories take place in, then you don't know which is the starting point and which is the ending point of a character's character arc.
I have defined a starting point for my headcanon (Donald Duck finds Pirate Gold) and an ending point (A Letter from Home). I agree that continuity and timeline go hand in hand, i just don't think too much about when the stories take place. I have, however, created a general system
Unless a story is stated to be set in a specific year (Like A Little Something Special, which is set in 1952 and Voodoo Hoodoo, which is set in 1949) i believe that
Stories published between 1942-1945 are set in 1946 Stories published between 1946-1947 are set in 1947 Stories published between 1948-1954 are set in 1948
Stories published between 1955-1961 are set in 1949
Stories published between 1962-1968 are set in 1950
Stories published between 1969-1975 are set in 1951
Stories published between 1976-1985 are set in 1952
Stories published between 1986-1992 are set in 1953
Stories published between 1993-1999 are set in 1954
Stories published between 2000-2006 are set in 1955
That's the way i organize the timeline in my personal canon
I agree with your general point. This whole project was mostly an attempt to see if a timeline could be done. Except for Duckfan's earlier work, I'm not sure if anyone has actually attempted to do an actual Barks/Rosa-timeline.
There must be a few out there. Rosa himself drew a lot of inspiration from a fictional biography of Scrooge. I've seen people ask about the timeline on Rosa's Facebook group too.
Of course, people would say that it's impossible and a waste of time since there would be somewhere around 600 or 700 stories to order with rather few indicators of where they fall in the timeline. I mostly just wanted to see if it really is as impossible as people say. Now I agree with them, and better yet - I have proof of the impossibilities!
So is that it? Is it a dead end? I wouldn't like to think so. I have hope that a coherent narrative can still emerge. But that may more a question of faith than reason. This might seem strange, but I think of questions on 'canon' and the like a bit like theology, like canon in the original sense of the word. But instead of systemically analyzing scripture, it's fiction. As a way to ground your (suspension of dis)belief. Anyway, that's a pet theory of mine. There's plenty of worse ways to analyze Disney comics --- by arguing that the World Wars didn't happen, for instance. That ignores how those conflicts and atrocities shaped postwar society, the world that is reflected in the comics. I find it tasteless.
Going back to your quote, I think that continuity and the timeline go hand in hand. Continuity means that things happen in the same universe and build on each other. This in turn means that one thing has to happen after the other. Also, if you don't know which order the stories take place in, then you don't know which is the starting point and which is the ending point of a character's character arc.
Well put!
Last Edit: Oct 9, 2021 22:44:44 GMT by That Duckfan
Barks made a 10-page story titled "The Victory Garden," in which Donald tries to grow... well, a victory garden. Such gardens were a way to aid the war effort during WWI and WWII. That's a very clear reference, if you ask me...
Speaking of victory gardens, how long after the war ended did people continue making victory gardens? I mean, was every garden abandoned as soon as the owner read about Adolf's defeat, or did the gardens continue until the economy stabilized a while later? I'm asking because I think it would be best for my head-canon timeline if HDL came to Donald soon after the war ended. I don't know much about gardening, but I assume you plant your crops some time in the spring. If that's so, is it then possible that The Victory Garden takes place in spring of 1946? Or would that be ridiculous?
If I'm not mistaken, many victory gardens remained active in 1946 in the US, but it seems unlikely to me that Donald would start his own after the war ended.
Well, it's mostly that I feel defeated by the task. My motivation has shrunk, so to speak. But knowing myself and my possibly unhealthy fixation with fictional continuity, I'll most likely get into the timeline-think again in the not-too-distant future. I guess I just need a break for now!
I think it may be possible to make a well-thought Barks-Rosa timeline, but i don't think one man can do it all by himself. It would take too long
If a group worked together, that could be done in less time and it would be easier
I've thought about that, but I fear a group would end up mired in disagreements over which parts to emphasize over others. There are too many inconsistencies.
I would place the story "A Little Something Special" after the "The Son of the Sun" because in "The Son of the Sun" "Glomgold implies that his interactions with Scrooge are limited to money--measuring contests". So i would place the story "Last Sled to Dawson" also after these stories as "A Little Something Special" is on 1952 and "Last Sled to Dawson" is on 1954.
I would place the story "A Little Something Special" after the "The Son of the Sun" because in "The Son of the Sun" "Glomgold implies that his interactions with Scrooge are limited to money--measuring contests". So i would place the story "Last Sled to Dawson" also after these stories as "A Little Something Special" is on 1952 and "Last Sled to Dawson" is on 1954.
The (incorrect) timeline in the first post of the thread notes that Back to Long Ago! is set in 1956, as 1564 is said to have been "392 years ago". Yet in this story, Scrooge has yet to find King Croesus' treasure. The treasure is however a part of Scrooge's museum display in The Son of the Sun, meaning that The Son of the Sun takes place in or after 1956. By extension, it would also have to take place after A Little Something Special (1952) and Last Sled to Dawson (1954).
However, your reasoning makes sense. I think that, going forward, if anyone is going to take a crack at a Barks/Rosa-timeline, one would have to ignore dates. The discrepancy I mentioned before between The Secret of Atlantis and The Gilded Man is proof enough that taking mentioned dates as gospel will not result in a coherent timeline that makes sense. For this reason I think that characters' characterization and references to other stories should be prioritized over a mentioned date. Otherwise one might as well say that the stories take place in the order they were published, which sort of defeats the purpose of constructing a timeline.
In addition, I think it makes more sense if A Little Something Special takes place afterLast Sled to Dawson, rather than vice versa. In Last Sled to Dawson, when Donald first sees Goldie, he says "It's Glittering Goldie! Uncle Scrooge's old flame from the gold rush days!". This seems like it's the first time he and the rest of the ducks has seen Goldie since Back to the Klondike. In addition, Goldie reading Scrooge's letter at the end of Last Sled to Dawson leads nicely into her being willing to travel all the way to Duckburg to visit him. I think that's more important than a ledger in the Money Bin saying "1954".
However, your reasoning makes sense. I think that, going forward, if anyone is going to take a crack at a Barks/Rosa-timeline, one would have to ignore dates. The discrepancy I mentioned before between The Secret of Atlantis and The Gilded Man is proof enough that taking mentioned dates as gospel will not result in a coherent timeline that makes sense. For this reason I think that characters' characterization and references to other stories should be prioritized over a mentioned date. Otherwise one might as well say that the stories take place in the order they were published, which sort of defeats the purpose of constructing a timeline.
In addition, I think it makes more sense if A Little Something Special takes place afterLast Sled to Dawson, rather than vice versa. In Last Sled to Dawson, when Donald first sees Goldie, he says "It's Glittering Goldie! Uncle Scrooge's old flame from the gold rush days!". This seems like it's the first time he and the rest of the ducks has seen Goldie since Back to the Klondike. In addition, Goldie reading Scrooge's letter at the end of Last Sled to Dawson leads nicely into her being willing to travel all the way to Duckburg to visit him. I think that's more important than a ledger in the Money Bin saying "1954".
I liked your explanation why "Last Sled to Dawson" is better to be placed after "A Little Something Special". Maybe Scrooge found an offer to buy ledgers with the wrong date or something.
At first, I am not trying to do a Barks/Rosa timeline because it's overwhelming, but only use all Rosa's stories and their references to Barks stories to do a Rosa-timeline. So if there was a Rosa's story that Donald doesn't know about coin collection, that story must be placed before "Secret of Atlantis" (and all other Barks' stories that Donald learn about coin collection for the first time) and all Rosa's stories that reference to 1916 coin must be placed after that imaginary Rosa's story, but I don't bother to place all Barks' stories based on Donald's knowing on coin collection.