What if Scrooge never existed?

[rombax]

What would happen to the Disney comics industry if "Christmas on Bear Mountain" was never published and Scrooge never existed? I remember Don Rosa said once that "Donald nowadays ows his existence to uncle Scrooge", so for how longs could the comics keep existing without him, and would they be still be published in the modern days?

Also I am terribly sorry if that same question has been asked before but I could't find enything.

[Hector]

I don't think Ducks comics would be more popular than Popeye.

[Matilda]

Joe Torcivia is one person who would be able to answer this question knowledgeably! I would guess that without Scrooge/Barks, Disney comics would have been more equivalent to the Looney Tunes comics in popularity and longevity in the U.S. Donald Duck comics would have been equivalent to Woody Woodpecker comics. Occasionally there was a story in WW, or Porky Pig, or Bugs Bunny comics which was as good as some of the best of the Disney comics--but nothing approaching the consistent output of Barks.

[deb]

Donald Duck comics would be where just about all of the other Western Publishing cartoon comic books are…rotting away in aging collector’s basements until they eventually end up in estate sales or antique shops. (Wow…that got dark fast…).

[RobbK1]

Oct 3, 2022 5:06:24 GMT deb said:

Donald Duck comics would be where just about all of the other Western Publishing cartoon comic books are…rotting away in aging collector’s basements until they eventually end up in estate sales or antique shops. (Wow…that got dark fast…).

Not necessarily.  The original poster asked where they would be if Barks had not invented Uncle Scrooge.  Barks was writing and drawing great stories for Donald and his nephews, and people like me loved those long adventures and domestic stories even without Scrooge.  If Barks had not invented Scrooge, he'd have had to invent other interesting and dynamic characters to spice up The Duck stories, and be catalysts to spur them on to have great adventures.  And he still would have kept up a great quality of artwork.  So, I think he still would have had a cult following among thousands of people Worldwide.  In fact, if he didn't have the rich uncle whose limitless money could get him anything he would want, or lead him on trips all over The World, he would likely have had to invent several different characters to take Donald and his Nephews all over The World (like a scientist or a few different ones in different sciences, a museum curator, an outdoorsman, an anthropologist, etc.  Like Gottfriedson did for Mickey.  The Duck Family tales might have been even more interesting, because of having more different interesting characters.  In later years, Barks became too formulaic and less inventive, because he already had his built-in crutch of having Scrooge and his money available for use in developing new plots, where he could use a similar story structure and general plot, and just change details.  He had less work to do than thinking hard and doing a lot of research first, before choosing what to write about.  I know these things, because I'm a story writer too.  Of course, he never could have been so very productive if he had to spend a lot of time thinking about what stories to tell and making them all high quality and very different.  

Uncle Scrooge was a terrific idea, and there are a lot of great stories with him as lead character.  But as much as I love his stories, I still Like Donald better, and I love all but Barks' very late stories, even the Barney Bear and Benny Burro, and Happy Hound and Droopy stories.  Barks' artwork and stories were great no matter which characters he was using.  He loved Gus Edson's "The Gumps" newspaper strip (as I do).  The bumbling protagonist (Andy Gump), (like Donald), had a brother (Uncle Bim), who was uncle to his son.  He owned several companies and was very rich.  He could do just about anything he wanted with all that money.  He used it to send Andy's son, Chester, all over the World, to have adventures.  THAT is where Barks got the idea for Donald having a rich uncle.  And he developed the rich man's character more, and made him even more interesting by giving him a fetish for money.  Had he not invented such a character, he'd have invented others to fill the gap needed to bring more interesting story plots into his regular series.

[crazycatlord]

A glance:

inducks.org/comp2.php?code=&keyw=&keywt=i&exactpg=&pg1=&pg2=&bro2=&bro3=&exactparts=&parts1=&parts2=&kind=0&rowsperpage=0&columnsperpage=0&hero=&xapp=DD&univ=&xa2=US&creat=&creat2=&plot=&plot2=&writ=&writ2=&art=&art2=&ink=&ink2=&excludeCZ=on&excludeUseDifferentCode=on&pub1=&pub2=&ser=&xref=&mref=&xrefd=&repabb=&repabbc=al&reppub1=&reppub2=&repnum=&imgmode=1&vdesc2=on&vdesc=pt-br&vbr=on&vpt=on&sort1=votes

[Of course, it is very probable that, without Scrooge, even many non-Scrooge Donald stories could not have been written)

[TheMidgetMoose]

I think I agree with RobbK1 's line of thinking on this. Even without Uncle Scrooge, Carl Barks was still a great writer and artist! He probably would have come up with other characters to fill the "Uncle Scrooge" role. He already created great characters like Gladstone Gander and Gyro Gearloose independently of Uncle Scrooge. Who knows what else he could have invented in this alternate reality where he for some reason does not invent Scrooge McDuck? It would be interesting to consider how a lack of Scrooge would affect other authors. For example, Don Rosa's most famous work is almost certainly The Life and Times of Scrooge McDuck. If there was no Scrooge, what would his career have looked like? Would he still have been as interested in Duck comics without Uncle Scrooge there in them?

A more saddening question would be, "What if Carl Barks never existed?" or maybe just "What if Carl Barks never worked for Disney?" Now that would produce a vastly different history for Donald Duck comics and probably would lead to the reality that Hector , Matilda ,and deb describe. That's not to dunk on the other early authors and artists for Disney comics, but Barks was really the heartbeat of the whole thing, if you will. There's some magic in his stories that I think was essential to the endurance and legacy of the brand. Part of me thinks that Duck comics would have just died out without him. Donald Duck himself would probably still be pretty well-known thanks to his animated appearances, but this whole expanded comics universe would, I think, be much less revered and perhaps even forgotten.

[Mesterius]

Oct 4, 2022 16:49:09 GMT TheMidgetMoose said:

I think I agree with RobbK1 's line of thinking on this. Even without Uncle Scrooge, Carl Barks was still a great writer and artist! He probably would have come up with other characters to fill the "Uncle Scrooge" role. He already created great characters like Gladstone Gander and Gyro Gearloose independently of Uncle Scrooge. Who knows what else he could have invented in this alternate reality where he for some reason does not invent Scrooge McDuck? It would be interesting to consider how a lack of Scrooge would affect other authors. For example, Don Rosa's most famous work is almost certainly The Life and Times of Scrooge McDuck. If there was no Scrooge, what would his career have looked like? Would he still have been as interested in Duck comics without Uncle Scrooge there in them?

A more saddening question would be, "What if Carl Barks never existed?" or maybe just "What if Carl Barks never worked for Disney?" Now that would produce a vastly different history for Donald Duck comics and probably would lead to the reality that Hector , Matilda ,and deb describe. That's not to dunk on the other early authors and artists for Disney comics, but Barks was really the heartbeat of the whole thing, if you will. There's some magic in his stories that I think was essential to the endurance and legacy of the brand. Part of me thinks that Duck comics would have just died out without him. Donald Duck himself would probably still be pretty well-known thanks to his animated appearances, but this whole expanded comics universe would, I think, be much less revered and perhaps even forgotten.

Gyro Gearloose was created several years after Uncle Scrooge. But I do agree with your points overall.

That question about Rosa is not even really a question. He would never have done any Duck comics if not for his love of Uncle Scrooge.

[RobbK1]

I agree 100% with what Midget Moose said above. The better question is "What would have happened to Disney Comics by now, IF Carl Barks hadn't worked for them?". The answer is that they would only possibly exist as marketing tools for current Disney films. Long-time characters, such as Mickey Mouse and Donald Duck probably would only have one-shot comic books out when films are re-released, or related to digital games also spun from the films. IF Barks had worked for WB, MGM, or Walter Lantz for 30-40 years, whatever characters he invented would have become super-popular, and lasted in popularity the longest.

[TheMidgetMoose]

Oct 5, 2022 5:49:05 GMT Mesterius said:

Gyro Gearloose was created several years after Uncle Scrooge. But I do agree with your points overall.

That question about Rosa is not even really a question. He would never have done any Duck comics if not for his love of Uncle Scrooge.

Indeed. Thanks for the correction. My phrasing was poor as I shouldn't have used the word "already." What I was thinking was that Gyro Gearloose's creation was, as far as I can tell, not dependent on Scrooge's creation. Such characters as Flintheart Glomgold and Magica de Spell would not have existed if they were not created as foils to Uncle Scrooge. Gladstone and Gyro are two characters who probably would have or certainly could have still been invented even if Scrooge McDuck was not.

[Mesterius]

Oct 5, 2022 13:09:54 GMT TheMidgetMoose said:

Oct 5, 2022 5:49:05 GMT Mesterius said:

Gyro Gearloose was created several years after Uncle Scrooge. But I do agree with your points overall.

That question about Rosa is not even really a question. He would never have done any Duck comics if not for his love of Uncle Scrooge.

Indeed. Thanks for the correction. My phrasing was poor as I shouldn't have used the word "already." What I was thinking was that Gyro Gearloose's creation was, as far as I can tell, not dependent on Scrooge's creation. Such characters as Flintheart Glomgold and Magica de Spell would not have existed if they were not created as foils to Uncle Scrooge. Gladstone and Gyro are two characters who probably would have or certainly could have still been invented even if Scrooge McDuck was not.

Yeah, you're right, they very likely would. The Beagle Boys, Glomgold and Magica are direct results of Scrooge becoming a central character, but Gladstone and Gyro were created to play off Donald, just like Scrooge himself.

[donalddisneyfan]

I got one further question to really make things more interesting, would DuckTales (both the 1987 and 2017 versions) ever have even existed if Scrooge never existed? How different would that show be if it still existed without Scrooge?

[bats]

Oct 4, 2022 16:49:09 GMT TheMidgetMoose said:

A more saddening question would be, "What if Carl Barks never existed?" or maybe just "What if Carl Barks never worked for Disney?" Now that would produce a vastly different history for Donald Duck comics and probably would lead to the reality that Hector , Matilda ,and deb describe. That's not to dunk on the other early authors and artists for Disney comics, but Barks was really the heartbeat of the whole thing, if you will. There's some magic in his stories that I think was essential to the endurance and legacy of the brand. Part of me thinks that Duck comics would have just died out without him. Donald Duck himself would probably still be pretty well-known thanks to his animated appearances, but this whole expanded comics universe would, I think, be much less revered and perhaps even forgotten.

Pedrocchi was writing competent long-form Donald adventures before Barks. Donald comics would've definitely have turned out differently and probably somewhat more Gottfredson-esque, but I think we'd have been fine. He's a good character at his core.