Scrooge's mystery brother in the Al Taliaferro's stories

[Daniel Maline]

In a short story by Al Taliaferro and Bob Karp, Donald complains to Grandma that Scrooge never gives anything to anyone. However, Grandma remembers well the events of the family and says that when Scrooge was nine years old he gave chickenpox to his brother. But in the 19th century, small children could easily die from the chickenpox because it was dangerous disease and highly contagious before vaccines. So, while this is a grim idea, is it possible that Scrooge accidentally and unknowingly caused the death of his younger brother? Or can we assume that this anonymous mystery brother means Gideon today?

inducks.org/story.php?c=YD+66-05-04%C2%A0

[sim]

Oct 5, 2021 15:14:39 GMT Daniel Maline said:

In a short story by Al Taliaferro and Bob Karp, Donald complains to Grandma that Scrooge never gives anything to anyone. However, Grandma remembers well the events of the family and says that when Scrooge was nine years old he gave chickenpox to his brother. But in the 19th century, small children could easily die from the chickenpox because it was dangerous disease and highly contagious before vaccines. So, while this is a grim idea, is it possible that Scrooge accidentally and unknowingly caused the death of his younger brother? Or can we assume that this anonymous mystery brother means Gideon today?

inducks.org/story.php?c=YD+66-05-04%C2%A0

Hi there, Daniel. I remember writing a blog post about that strip nearly a decade ago, and we also already talked about it in this very forum, wondering if that duck-lady could be Don's mother instead of Grandma Duck (because of the different look and the fact that she knows something about US' childhood).

Beside that, I never considered the death-joke behind that sentence, but it could work since there is no evidence for a living Scrooge's brother in the whole strip production. If we accept the fact that the brother has survived instead, he could be either Gideon (but that would mean that the two have a birth-gap of 8/9 years to the utmost) or his twin brother (somebody referred to him as Cheeryble McDuck on this forum, but in the story he makes his only appearance they are both called Scrooge). Anyway, I personally would exclude him being Rumpus McFowl, because I don't deem they grew up together (because of their fake cousinhood thing).

[Fethryfan]

Oct 5, 2021 15:14:39 GMT Daniel Maline said:

In a short story by Al Taliaferro and Bob Karp, Donald complains to Grandma that Scrooge never gives anything to anyone. However, Grandma remembers well the events of the family and says that when Scrooge was nine years old he gave chickenpox to his brother. But in the 19th century, small children could easily die from the chickenpox because it was dangerous disease and highly contagious before vaccines. So, while this is a grim idea, is it possible that Scrooge accidentally and unknowingly caused the death of his younger brother? Or can we assume that this anonymous mystery brother means Gideon today?

inducks.org/story.php?c=YD+66-05-04%C2%A0

We have six solutions
1- The brother is Gideon
2- The brother is Papirone
3- The brother is Rumpus
4- The brother died in infancy 
5- Scrooge has yet another living brother whom we've never met
5- Disregard this strip entirely

In my headcanon, options 3 and 4 are the most likely. I'd hate to disregard a Taliaferro-Karp strip unless there is no other solution and the idea of trying to fit another brother of Scrooge in my Barks-Rosa centered universe is not appealing. I've already had much trouble with Gideon and only accepted him because he is one of my favorite McDucks! As for Papirone, he is not a real character to me, to be honest. I've never even READ the story in which he appears

As for Gideon, i believe he was born around 1884, when Scrooge was 17, so i don't think he is the brother

If Scrooge's brother died due to chicken pox, maybe that's another reason for Fergus and Scrooge to be in the McDuck cemetery in the first chapter of Life and Times. They could be visiting the boy's grave one year after his death

Rumpus is Scroge's half-brother, but he (Rumpus) didn't knew about it until they were both old men. However, Scrooge has known this secret for some time. He could've passed chicken pox to Rumpus when they were both children and both thought they were cousins.

Now, Grandma and Scrooge are really close friends. They have know each other for over 50 years! Scrooge trusts Elvira, so it's not impossible that after finding out that Rumpus was his brother, he told Grandma about it and also told about the chicken pox thing, since he trusts her. This strip probably take place after Travails, so now that all the family knows the secret, Grandma doesn't needs to keep it anymore and told Donald about it

Or, as some here have theorized, this Grandma could be retconned as Matilda who also knew about her half-brother. Either way, this strip has to take place after Travails for this to be true because Donald doesn't seems to be surprised that Scrooge had a brother at age 9

Then again, that's only my opinion on how this could fit in my personal universe, and is by no means an official statement. Would love to hear the theories of everyone here

[Daniel Maline]

Oct 5, 2021 15:29:24 GMT sim said:

Oct 5, 2021 15:14:39 GMT Daniel Maline said:

In a short story by Al Taliaferro and Bob Karp, Donald complains to Grandma that Scrooge never gives anything to anyone. However, Grandma remembers well the events of the family and says that when Scrooge was nine years old he gave chickenpox to his brother. But in the 19th century, small children could easily die from the chickenpox because it was dangerous disease and highly contagious before vaccines. So, while this is a grim idea, is it possible that Scrooge accidentally and unknowingly caused the death of his younger brother? Or can we assume that this anonymous mystery brother means Gideon today?

inducks.org/story.php?c=YD+66-05-04%C2%A0

Hi there, Daniel. I remember writing a blog post about that strip nearly a decade ago, and we also already talked about it in this very forum, wondering if that duck-lady could be Don's mother instead of Grandma Duck (because of the different look and the fact that she knows something about US' childhood).

Beside that, I never considered the death-joke behind that sentence, but it could work since there is no evidence for a living Scrooge's brother in the whole strip production. If we accept the fact that the brother has survived instead, he could be either Gideon (but that would mean that the two have a birth-gap of 8/9 years to the utmost) or his twin brother (somebody referred to him as Cheeryble McDuck on this forum, but in the story he makes his only appearance they are both called Scrooge). Anyway, I personally would exclude him being Rumpus McFowl, because I don't deem they grew up together (because of their fake cousinhood thing).

Thank you. So it must have been your old post that inspired me to start this new chain. I saw a picture of that story here and started wondering who this brother might be. I thought it couldn’t be Rumpus McFowl, because according to Van Horn, Rumpus is older brother of Scrooge and moved away from home before Scrooge was born (Source: Ankantekijät 5 - Aavemaan Aarre (The Hauntland Treasure), a commented collection of Van Horn’s own favorites). Then all that remains is Gideon or an anonymous brother who died. However, I didn’t know that Scrooge has a third named brother, this twin brother Zio Paperone is completely new to me (maybe precisely because he only appears in one story that has never been published in Finland). However, nice to hear about the new characters as well.

[sim]

Oct 5, 2021 19:44:46 GMT Daniel Maline said:

Oct 5, 2021 15:29:24 GMT sim said:

Hi there, Daniel. I remember writing a blog post about that strip nearly a decade ago, and we also already talked about it in this very forum, wondering if that duck-lady could be Don's mother instead of Grandma Duck (because of the different look and the fact that she knows something about US' childhood).

Beside that, I never considered the death-joke behind that sentence, but it could work since there is no evidence for a living Scrooge's brother in the whole strip production. If we accept the fact that the brother has survived instead, he could be either Gideon (but that would mean that the two have a birth-gap of 8/9 years to the utmost) or his twin brother (somebody referred to him as Cheeryble McDuck on this forum, but in the story he makes his only appearance they are both called Scrooge). Anyway, I personally would exclude him being Rumpus McFowl, because I don't deem they grew up together (because of their fake cousinhood thing).

Thank you. So it must have been your old post that inspired me to start this new chain. I saw a picture of that story here and started wondering who this brother might be. I thought it couldn’t be Rumpus McFowl, because according to Van Horn, Rumpus is older brother of Scrooge and moved away from home before Scrooge was born (Source: Ankantekijät 5 - Aavemaan Aarre (The Hauntland Treasure), a commented collection of Van Horn’s own favorites). Then all that remains is Gideon or an anonymous brother who died. However, I didn’t know that Scrooge has a third named brother, this twin brother Zio Paperone is completely new to me (maybe precisely because he only appears in one story that has never been published in Finland). However, nice to hear about the new characters as well.

I had no idea of that comment from Van Horn because - as I wrote in another thread - he sent me a letter in 2012 in which he said:

Jul 7, 2021 16:19:21 GMT sim said:

"I really do not know if Rumpus is older than Scrooge. Could be."

So, I don't understand how could he know it in 2006, whatever.

Re: Scrooge's twin, we only know that he lives in the West and that, unlike his stingy brother, he is super generous and spendthrift. In fact, he looks for gold mines, but he gives them away as a benefactor. He is a simple poor old man living outside and eating beans, but he is recognized in the town as a philanthropist (they erected a statue for him and the shops take their name after him). His name is the same as Scrooge, Paperone, and this may cause some confusion, surely it does to Donald and nephews (I guess this is why on internet you can find fan-made names such as "Papirone"). His nickname is mani buche, which essentially means "spendthrift".

[crazycatlord]

Oct 5, 2021 15:14:39 GMT Daniel Maline said:

 But in the 19th century, small children could easily die from the chickenpox because it was dangerous disease and highly contagious before vaccines. So, while this is a grim idea, is it possible that Scrooge accidentally and unknowingly caused the death of his younger brother? Or can we assume that this anonymous mystery brother means Gideon today?

inducks.org/story.php?c=YD+66-05-04%C2%A0

I suspect that, for children, chickenpox never was a particularly dangerous disease; even today, the treatment for chickenpox is basically to alleviate the symptoms, not to cure the disease. Then, if today, even without a real treatment (and vaccines for chickenpox are very recent) are very few child death from chickenpox, I doubt that was much different in the 19th century. And note that was common, when a children had chickenpox, the families join all children (brothers, cousins, sometimes neighbors) with him/her to infect (and immunize) all - I doubt that they will do that if it was a disease with serious life danger.

Yes, probably I am digressing for an almost off-topic issue...

[Mesterius]

I think these are THE weirdest duck beaks I've ever seen. How do they even close properly?

[sim]

Oct 6, 2021 3:12:47 GMT Mesterius said:

I think these are THE weirdest duck beaks I've ever seen. How do they even close properly?

This is the style Carpi used to draw them back in the fifties (I guess it was influenced by Chierchini's inking), his characters changed again and again in the later decade (probably the Beagle Boys were the ones he drew in the weirdest way, at times fat and short, at time slim); by the '70s/80s however, Carpi was one of the greatest Duck artists in the world because he achieved a perfect Disney style.

[mousemaestro]

Oct 5, 2021 15:29:24 GMT sim said:

Oct 5, 2021 15:14:39 GMT Daniel Maline said:

In a short story by Al Taliaferro and Bob Karp, Donald complains to Grandma that Scrooge never gives anything to anyone. However, Grandma remembers well the events of the family and says that when Scrooge was nine years old he gave chickenpox to his brother. But in the 19th century, small children could easily die from the chickenpox because it was dangerous disease and highly contagious before vaccines. So, while this is a grim idea, is it possible that Scrooge accidentally and unknowingly caused the death of his younger brother? Or can we assume that this anonymous mystery brother means Gideon today?

inducks.org/story.php?c=YD+66-05-04%C2%A0

Hi there, Daniel. I remember writing a blog post about that strip nearly a decade ago, and we also already talked about it in this very forum, wondering if that duck-lady could be Don's mother instead of Grandma Duck (because of the different look and the fact that she knows something about US' childhood).

Beside that, I never considered the death-joke behind that sentence, but it could work since there is no evidence for a living Scrooge's brother in the whole strip production. If we accept the fact that the brother has survived instead, he could be either Gideon (but that would mean that the two have a birth-gap of 8/9 years to the utmost) or his twin brother (somebody referred to him as Cheeryble McDuck on this forum, but in the story he makes his only appearance they are both called Scrooge). Anyway, I personally would exclude him being Rumpus McFowl, because I don't deem they grew up together (because of their fake cousinhood thing).

Excellent blog, sim. 

[cacou]

I think it's fair to consider that the character in YD 66-05-04 really is Grandma Duck. Taliaferro changed his style continuously and significantly in the 1960s, but in this other strip from the same period, the same character appears (and she's named Grandma Duck)
inducks.org/comp2.php?code=yd+66&keyw=&keywt=i&exactpg=&pg1=&pg2=&bro2=&bro3=&exactparts=&parts1=&parts2=&kind=0&rowsperpage=0&columnsperpage=0&hero=&xapp=gd&univ=&xa2=&creat=&creat2=&plot=&plot2=&writ=&writ2=&art=&art2=&ink=&ink2=&excludeCZ=on&excludeUseDifferentCode=on&pub1=&pub2=&ser=&xref=&mref=&xrefd=&repabb=&repabbc=al&reppub1=&reppub2=&imgmode=1&vdesc2=on&vdesc=en&vau=on&vdc=on&vgy=on&vnz=on&vus=on&vuk=on&sort1=auto

[sim]

Oct 14, 2021 21:14:34 GMT cacou said:

I think it's fair to consider that the character in YD 66-05-04 really is Grandma Duck. Taliaferro changed his style continuously and significantly in the 1960s, but in this other strip from the same period, the same character appears (and she's named Grandma Duck)
inducks.org/comp2.php?code=yd+66&keyw=&keywt=i&exactpg=&pg1=&pg2=&bro2=&bro3=&exactparts=&parts1=&parts2=&kind=0&rowsperpage=0&columnsperpage=0&hero=&xapp=gd&univ=&xa2=&creat=&creat2=&plot=&plot2=&writ=&writ2=&art=&art2=&ink=&ink2=&excludeCZ=on&excludeUseDifferentCode=on&pub1=&pub2=&ser=&xref=&mref=&xrefd=&repabb=&repabbc=al&reppub1=&reppub2=&imgmode=1&vdesc2=on&vdesc=en&vau=on&vdc=on&vgy=on&vnz=on&vus=on&vuk=on&sort1=auto

Yes, I think it was already posted in the other thread I was referring to when I said: "we also already talked about it in this very forum, wondering if that duck-lady could be Don's mother instead of Grandma Duck" and we in fact agreed that she wasn't Donald's mother.

[RobbK1]

Oct 6, 2021 3:12:47 GMT Mesterius said:

I think these are THE weirdest duck beaks I've ever seen. How do they even close properly?

The bottom side of the beak' top plate would be left uncovered, and so, subject to infections greater than if the mouth could close fully.

[bats]

Oct 6, 2021 7:17:27 GMT sim said:

Oct 6, 2021 3:12:47 GMT Mesterius said:

I think these are THE weirdest duck beaks I've ever seen. How do they even close properly?

This is the style Carpi used to draw them back in the fifties (I guess it was influenced by Chierchini's inking), his characters changed again and again in the later decade (probably the Beagle Boys were the ones he drew in the weirdest way, at times fat and short, at time slim); by the '70s/80s however, Carpi was one of the greatest Duck artists in the world because he achieved a perfect Disney style.

Carpi's 50s art feels like it's somewhat inspired by Perego, who had his own rather unique takes on duck anatomy.

[sim]

Oct 14, 2021 23:20:49 GMT RobbK1 said:

Oct 6, 2021 3:12:47 GMT Mesterius said:

I think these are THE weirdest duck beaks I've ever seen. How do they even close properly?

The bottom side of the beak' top plate would be left uncovered, and so, subject to infections greater than if the mouth could close fully.

And that is how Daffy Duck is drawn, isn't it?

[RobbK1]

Oct 15, 2021 1:04:12 GMT sim said:

Oct 14, 2021 23:20:49 GMT RobbK1 said:

The bottom side of the beak' top plate would be left uncovered, and so, subject to infections greater than if the mouth could close fully.

And that is how Daffy Duck is drawn, isn't it?

Sometimes.  But only by weak artists.  It's off model.  The top of the beak should only be ever-so-slightly longer than the bottom, not half-again as long.