Grandpa Duck

[Hector]

Jan 25, 2017 19:03:12 GMT Scrooge MacDuck said:

Here is a thread (on my and drakeborough's initiative) to list (and think about) all known appearances or mentions of Grandpa Duck, Grandma's probably-deceased husband, of which there certainly is no shortage.

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March of 1964 — Vic Lockman (?), Tony Strobl & Steve Steere
Half of the short but memorable story The Good Old Daze (from Donald Duck #93) is a flashback to Donald's youth, centering around the old Grandpa Duck, who was a lazy but street-smart fellow similar to Donald himself, and always arranged for Donald to be off somewhere else when Grandma was baking pies so he could eat them all himself.

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I've read that story. That was an awful version of Grandpa Duck. It is depressing to see that Donald wasted his entire childhood working all day like a slave and not eating cakes! And what was Grandma Duck doing? Why did she let that jerk have it his way and never stood up for her little grandson? Why did she even marry that horrible man in the first place? Was it because, back then, marriages were arranged and women were not allowed to tell their opinion so she didn't have much of a choice either? In that case, it makes the story even more depressing to know that such a good natured woman wasted her life with someone like him.
I know what you'll say: 'Chill, Whatever, it's just comedy.' Probably, but Disney stories are supposed to be read by kids. And, whenever I read such stories in my childhood, stories where justice was not served, I had no fun at all. Maybe I was just a weird kid.

[LP]

Here's a panel from Attic Antics (W WDC 132-04) depicting another strong contender for Grandpa Duck. Similarly to Too Much Help, this is nothing more than a photo in the background. However, two elements make this more interesting:
1) This is a story drawn by Barks.
2) There is the fact that these photos are obviously supposed to depict a married couple, and it would be odd if Grandma had another couple's wedding photos on her wall...meaning that this is likely Elvira and Dabney.



Unfortunately, the pictured Duck is pretty featureless and generic. However, he reminds me of the portraits featured in the bottom row from other stories.

[RobbK1]

Aug 18, 2020 21:59:59 GMT LP said:

Here's a panel from Attic Antics (W WDC 132-04) depicting another strong contender for Grandpa Duck. Similarly to Too Much Help, this is nothing more than a photo in the background. However, two elements make this more interesting:
1) This is a story drawn by Barks.
2) There is the fact that these photos are obviously supposed to depict a married couple, and it would be odd if Grandma had another couple's wedding photos on her wall...meaning that this is likely Elvira and Dabney.



Unfortunately, the pictured Duck is pretty featureless and generic. However, he reminds me of the portraits featured in the bottom row from other stories.

The couple could also logically be her parents.  But it would be more convenient to have it be her and her husband.  Then, we'd have had Carl Barks having drawn Grandpa Duck in a published story, rather than otherwise only referred to him when Donald borrowed his old horse for "The Backwards Race" in the 1943 10-pager, originally drawn for Walt Disney's Comics and Stories, but was printed, instead, in Donald Duck Four Color Series #29.

[LP]

Aug 20, 2020 7:16:29 GMT RobbK1 said:

The couple could also logically be her parents.  But it would be more convenient to have it be her and her husband.  Then, we'd have had Carl Barks having drawn Grandpa Duck in a published story, rather than otherwise only referred to him when Donald borrowed his old horse for "The Backwards Race" in the 1943 10-pager, originally drawn for Walt Disney's Comics and Stories, but was printed, instead, in Donald Duck Four Color Series #29.

You're right - it could just as well be her parents. It's annoying that we can't know for sure.

[That Duckfan]

Is that, likely though? We're talking about Donald's great-grandparents here. Even if you don't subscribe to Rosa theory about Clinton Coot and Gertrude Gadwall, Grandma's parents must have married some time in the 1850s. Those would have to be some very early portraits.

(Besides, they look more like Hortense and Quackmore to me.)

[LP]

Aug 20, 2020 11:02:49 GMT That Duckfan said:

Is that, likely though? We're talking about Donald's great-grandparents here. Even if you don't subscribe to Rosa theory about Clinton Coot and Gertrude Gadwall, Grandma's parents must have married some time in the 1850s. Those would have to be some very early portraits.

(Besides, they look more like Hortense and Quackmore to me.)

1850s being pretty early for photography is a good point that I did not consider. As for them looking like Hortense and Quackmore... I agree, but it would be somewhat odd to only have one of your many offsprings' wedding photo on your wall.
If we're going on authorial intent, I'm pretty sure Barks intended them to be Elvira and her husband.

[RobbK1]

Aug 20, 2020 15:32:24 GMT LP said:

Aug 20, 2020 11:02:49 GMT That Duckfan said:

Is that, likely though? We're talking about Donald's great-grandparents here. Even if you don't subscribe to Rosa theory about Clinton Coot and Gertrude Gadwall, Grandma's parents must have married some time in the 1850s. Those would have to be some very early portraits.

(Besides, they look more like Hortense and Quackmore to me.)

1850s being pretty early for photography is a good point that I did not consider. As for them looking like Hortense and Quackmore... I agree, but it would be somewhat odd to only have one of your many offsprings' wedding photo on your wall.
If we're going on authorial intent, I'm pretty sure Barks intended them to be Elvira and her husband.

Commercial photography started in the 1840s.  So, they could well be photographs.  But, they could also be small paintings.  However, it makes it a lot more convenient to assume they are Grandma and Grandpa Duck. However, I am one of the few fans that believes that Grandpa Duck was still alive when Huey, Dewey, and Louie were young, because of the wording in the story in which Donald borrows Grandpa's horse, and the fact that horses live a lot shorter lives than humans.  As I remember, Donald dashes off to borrow "Grandpa's horse" (which implies that Grandpa is still alive).  The fact that Grandpa is not depicted in action in a story when Donald is grown up, or where Huey, Dewey, and Louie also appear is not absolute proof that he wasn't still alive at that moment.  The fact that Grandpa wasn't depicted in any of the family gathering stories also is not absolute proof that he wasn't still alive at that moment. Maybe he didn't like "all that commotion" when he was very old, and he ate in his study while reading "Mickey Mouse" or "Super Snooper" Comic books, or watching Super Snooper cartoons on TV?  Or, maybe he was always busy writing his memoirs, and whenever guests came, he just had Grandma leave his dinner outside his study's door?

[LP]

Aug 20, 2020 17:28:30 GMT RobbK1 said:

Commercial photography started in the 1840s.  So, they could well be photographs.  But, they could also be small paintings.  However, it makes it a lot more convenient to assume they are Grandma and Grandpa Duck. However, I am one of the few fans that believes that Grandpa Duck was still alive when Huey, Dewey, and Louie were young, because of the wording in the story in which Donald borrows Grandpa's horse, and the fact that horses live a lot shorter lives than humans.  As I remember, Donald dashes off to borrow "Grandpa's horse" (which implies that Grandpa is still alive).  The fact that Grandpa is not depicted in action in a story when Donald is grown up, or where Huey, Dewey, and Louie also appear is not absolute proof that he wasn't still alive at that moment.  The fact that Grandpa wasn't depicted in any of the family gathering stories also is not absolute proof that he wasn't still alive at that moment. Maybe he didn't like "all that commotion" when he was very old, and he ate in his study while reading "Mickey Mouse" or "Super Snooper" Comic books, or watching Super Snooper cartoons on TV?  Or, maybe he was always busy writing his memoirs, and whenever guests came, he just had Grandma leave his dinner outside his study's door?

You used the word "convenient" before too. I'm not sure I fully understand what you mean by it in this context.

In The Hard Loser, Donald mentions that HDL are "tryin' to beat me to Grandpa's" since they are running ahead of him, and "I'll see you boys at Grandpa's". This does indeed imply that Grandpa is alive, as they refer to his residence as "his". If they were talking about Grandma's farm, and if she was the only living resident there, it would be odd for Donald to still refer to it as "Grandpa's".

There's also the possibility that Grandma and Grandpa are separated in this story, and he doesn't live on the farm. This would be why Donald doesn't say "I'll see you boys at the farm". Since the Ducks run from what appears to be the inner city to the rural outskirts of Duckburg, rather than using any vehicle, Grandpa not living on the farm actually makes sense. This theory would also explain why Grandpa is never seen at family gatherings.
Of course, this doesn't mesh with the fact that Grandma keeps their wedding photos on the wall, which would be a constant reminder of him every time she enters her house.

While I do believe that authorial intent was for Grandpa Duck to be alive in The Hard Loser, I'll have to think it over before moving around his year of death in my head-canon. 

[That Duckfan]

If we're talking about Grandpa Duck's death, I think it's important to add one other character to the equation: Gus Goose. I expect he was hired as a farm hand either to replace Grandpa Duck, or after he became too infirm to work. Having Gus work on Grandma's farm was invented by Western's editors over the 1949/50 holidays (first appearing in the Barks-drawn Donald's Grandma Duck, although the recycling of earlier gags suggests that this story may serve another role in the continuity). This was a kind of composite, as neither character had appeared in the comic books before then, only in the strips. By their next appearance, the two adopted Gus and Jaq, the Cinderella Mice.

Gus appeared in three strip continuities.
The first, which I've privately titled Donald's Cousin Gus, ran from May 9, 1938 to May 24, 1938. In the penultimate comic, Donald gets even more staying relatives: Huey, Dewey, and Louie, in that brief period of time when they still returned to their parents from time to time. Gus' home town is mentioned, Honking-on-the-Hudson (so... East Coast?), as is the date: May 1938.
The second, which I've privately titled A City Slicker, ran from November 7, 1938 to November 25, 1938. Here, Donald goes to Gus' farm (train stop Pumpkin Center), and brings home a goat that proceeds to give him more trouble. When he returns, the nephews are also in his house. I don't think they leave for their parents anymore at this point.
The third and final continuity ran from November 11, 1941 to November 29, 1941. Donald and the boys go to Honking-on-the-Hudson, where they also meet Daisy and her country niece Dottie. Gus briefly flirts with Daisy.

Grandma appeared in three strip continuities as well.
The first, which I've privately titled Donald's Grandma Duck, ran from September 27, 1943 to October 13, 1943. Grandma seems to come from a rural background, but we never see her farm. It is unknown which town she came from. She seems to be very old, having fought Indians in one comic and saving Confederate currency in another.
The second, which ran from December 6, 1943 to to December 11, 1943, is very brief. Grandma makes some intermittent appearances in 1944, and seems to be living in a suburban house much like Donald.
The third and final continuity ran from September 27, 1948 to October 2, 1948. Grandma once again arrives by train.

Grandma makes one cross-over appearance in a Taliaferro-drawn two page story in WDC 100, where she visits Donald for the 1948 Christmas holidays. Also, Barks used her in Atonal Terror (WDC 85) in 1947, but that one's an outlier. She doesn't return until the aforementioned Donald's Grandma Duck.

I would say that The Hard Loser could take place in the period when HDL only visited Donald intermittently, and that Grandpa died not soon after, leading to the situation as we know it today. Could Grandma's stern black clothing in the early comics be a sign of mourning?

[LP]

Aug 20, 2020 21:01:19 GMT That Duckfan said:

If we're talking about Grandpa Duck's death, I think it's important to add one other character to the equation: Gus Goose.

Gus being Grandpa's replacement makes a lot of sense. It's so obvious in hindsight, yet I've never thought of it! 
When I read through the Taliaferro-strips, I remember wondering whether Gus' farm is the same as Grandma's farm (via retcon, of course), or if Gus had his own farm at first but then started working for Grandma. Well, Grandma's farm certainly isn't located on the East coast - it's in the outskirts of Duckburg, so the two farms are probably separate.

With all this in mind, my guess is that Grandpa died some time not long after Donald and HDL visited Gus' farm in Honking-on-the-Hudson, as Gus's services aren't needed on Grandma's farm yet; but before Grandma visits Donald and the boys for the first time, as there is no mention of any grandfather not coming along. (The Hard Loser was first published the same month as the strip in which Grandma visits the Ducks, so this even works from an out-of-universe perspective. Hooray.)

This clashes with most every story showing Donald growing up on Grandma's farm, as Grandpa is almost never present. The assumption has been that he died when Donald was only a toddler, but this seems to be incorrect.

Grandma has been seen wearing black in her youth too, and long after her husband died, so I wouldn't associate her clothing with mourning.

[That Duckfan]

What's the most chronologically recent appearance of Grandpa Duck? My guess would be the flashback in Sign of the Triple Distelfink?

[LP]

Aug 21, 2020 21:29:44 GMT That Duckfan said:

What's the most chronologically recent appearance of Grandpa Duck? My guess would be the flashback in Sign of the Triple Distelfink?

INDUCKS treats Humperdink/Dabney and Grandpa Duck as different characters for some reason. Anyways, my guess is that Dabney was last seen in I TL 2875-5 (though, INDUCKS doesn't list him as appearing there), and "Grandpa" last appeared in D 2010-108 in 2013.

I don't see any reason to treat these as separate characters.

[That Duckfan]

Aug 22, 2020 7:58:18 GMT LP said:

Aug 21, 2020 21:29:44 GMT That Duckfan said:

What's the most chronologically recent appearance of Grandpa Duck? My guess would be the flashback in Sign of the Triple Distelfink?

INDUCKS treats Humperdink/Dabney and Grandpa Duck as different characters for some reason. Anyways, my guess is that Dabney was last seen in I TL 2875-5 (though, INDUCKS doesn't list him as appearing there), and "Grandpa" last appeared in D 2010-108 in 2013.

I don't see any reason to treat these as separate characters.

I meant chronologically as in-universe. Any stories where we see him while Donald is a teenager, for instance?

[LP]

Aug 22, 2020 8:08:18 GMT That Duckfan said:

I meant chronologically as in-universe. Any stories where we see him while Donald is a teenager, for instance?

Aah, I see. The only story I can think of where Donald and Grandpa interact at all is The Good Old Daze, but Donald is somewhere around 5-10 in that story. 

[LP]

This portrait can be found in Grandma's house in You Can't Guess by Carl Barks. 



It could very well be an older version of the duck in the portrait which I posted about before. In addition, this duck-man looks similar enough to Dabney from Rosa's Lo$ 10 that I imagine the two to be the same character.