At any moment Nerbini was responsable for the name Topolino.
Well, based on your post, that was due to the fact that he was already known as "Topolino" in the cartoons. And we don't know who made that decision. But thanks for a very informative post! I assume Donald's name follows a similar trajectory, and of course the names of all the supporting characters would follow from there.
Speaking of translations: there's actually a few character names where I like the Dutch version (which I grew up with) better than the original. For example, in English, Glittering Goldie's full name is listed as "Goldie O'Gilt" per Rosa, which I find a rather unimaginative and boring name. In Dutch, however, her full name was once said to be Olivia Bladgoud (Olivia Goldleaf), which I find a great name. Same goes for Rockerduck (Rockefeather, who is a billionaire character on DuckTales, would have sounded SO much better in the original version). Although current Dutch stories use the name Rockerduck as well, in some older translations he was called "Leopold Kwartjesvinder" (Leopold Quarterfinder). In both these cases, it's difficult to translate them to English without losing their charm, but in Dutch they have a great ring to them. Barks would always come up with these funny character names like Beauregard Swinely, Gasmore Gravytrain, Hiram Pumpkindew, Mesmer J Spellcaster, Swansdown-Swoonsudden, etc., and I find that these old Dutch translations were much more reminiscent of that than the original names.
Also, I like "Dora Duck" (Grandma Duck's Duck's full name in Dutch) much better than "Elvira Duck".
Edit: some names I absolutely adore, by the way. In German, the Beagle Boys are named "die Panzerknacker", which has an amazing sound to it, and translates to something like "the Armor Breakers".
It also gave way to a beautiful "etymology" sequence during chapter 2 of Scrooge's Life and Times, where young Scrooge tells the police: "Moment! Hier, das ist eine Panzerschrank-Knacker-Bande!" while ripping the mask off one of them. (which means "Wait! This is a safe-breaking gang!", alluding to the events before) and the reader is led to believe that the Boys liked the ring to it and shortened it to "Panzerknacker". I have no idea how that dialogue went in Don's original but it's such a great moment in the German translation.
Orora Reginella is called Marbella in German. Loses the meaning but fits her very well, I think
The character in your avatar was called "Prinzessin Allröschen" in German. Basically a variation on "Dornröschen" (=Sleeping Beauty) with the cosmos thrown in for good measure. But it is explained that Goofy just made up that name, they didn't know her real name...
I've seen some fans complaining about The Blot's unmasked appearance being called "Plattnase", which simply means "flat nose", but I don't mind.
"Pomp" suggests someone who likes "pomp and circumstance," i.e. showy, fussy ceremony. I haven't read enough stories with Jubal Pomp to know whether that applies to him in any way. Does he like to show off? Is he self-important? Or does he put on an appearance that's "just for show," without much serious content?
Definitely!!! That's all he is about, really. And it often leads to very funny scenes when he is trying to present another stupid idea to Scrooge (or, in a recent case, Donald who has started working for Rockerduck...).
Also, a question I meant to ask earlier: did the Italian names for the main Disney characters ("Topolino", "Paperino") originate from the translations of the original animated cartoons, or were they created for the comics?
"Topolino" and "Paperino" were, I believe, both created for the comics—"Topolino" comes from the first newspaper in Italy to run the daily strip (in 1930).
Notably, the two names are technically Mickey's and Donald's surnames; their full names, at least in the 1930s, were Micchi Topolino and Paolino Paperino (Donald's is still current; I'm not sure if Mickey's has changed).
Notably also, the term "paper-" applies to geese and goslings; the Ducks are at least nominally geese in Italy, though I think any cartoon fan worth their salt understands that wasn't the original intent.
"Topolino" and "Paperino" were, I believe, both created for the comics—"Topolino" comes from the first newspaper in Italy to run the daily strip (in 1930).
Were the characters referred to as "Mickey Mouse" and "Donald Duck" in the Italian versions of the animated shorts?
Everything is dubbed in europe to local languages, every country has their own names for famous characters
That's not the point, you seem to have missed a message or two there — David Gerstein just explained that the usual Italian names for Mickey and Donald were created for the comics — hence the question of what they were called in the cartoons beforehand.
It is wrong. Mickey was a global cinematic success from the very beginning, 1928. Also in Italy, where he always went by the name of Topolino I suppose (not totally sure anyhow). I think that the Italian translators of the cartoons called him like that! They needed an appealing name to put into the cinematographic posters, and it had to sound Italian. Also, the Fascist regime imposed to Italianize every name in any foreign movie. It was the law!
By the way...Gottfredson's comics coming to Europe before Disney's cartoon??? Seriously? Guys, you seem unaware of the basic history of the 20th century cinema, or at least of Mickey's role within it.
Actually, Gottfredson's strips were the ones who arrived in Italy with two years of delay, in late 1932. Here is the story. The first Italian Mickey Mouse comics were done only in 1932 by an editor from Florence, mr. Nerbini, without the authorization of the Disney studios, exactly to exploit the even greater attention that Mickey had gained for just receiving an Academy Award! It would have been strange to change the name of the very character - as known in Italy - whose fame he was trying to exploit!
Nerbini was not actually dishonest on the rights issue, he probably made a technical mistake: he asked the permission to the Italian company who only had the rights on the distribution of Mickey's cartoons, not printed material. He was quickly asked to stop the publication. For a while, in order not to dismiss the publication, he changed Topolino ("little mouse", the official name of Mickey) into Topo Lino (Linus Mouse):
After a few weeks the problem was solved and Nerbini received the authorization by the Kings Syndicate to publish Mickey Mouse, but not original material, the Gottfredson's one. The Americans basically told him: "ok, if you want to publish Mickey, you must publish the real WAK!":
At any moment Nerbini was responsable for the name Topolino.
At any moment Nerbini was responsable for the name Topolino.
Well, based on your post, that was due to the fact that he was already known as "Topolino" in the cartoons. And we don't know who made that decision. But thanks for a very informative post! I assume Donald's name follows a similar trajectory, and of course the names of all the supporting characters would follow from there.
On the website isuu.com, I found a preview of the 2012 book "I Disney Italiani", by Alberto Becattini, Luca Boschi, Leonardo Gori and Andrea Sani. One of the pages shown in the preview say that, based on commericals made by the company Pittaluga appearing in the first months of 1930, we can deduce 1930 was the year in which the first Mickey shorts were shown in Italy. The article notes that the character has already been renamed Topolino, and we see a commerical in which both names (Mickey Mouse and Topolino) are used together:
As for when Mickey's strips first appeared in Italy, here is Inducks' answer. Some strips appeared in 1930 and 1931, predating the first issue of Topolino whose official release date was 31 December 1932.
Speaking of translations: there's actually a few character names where I like the Dutch version (which I grew up with) better than the original. For example, in English, Glittering Goldie's full name is listed as "Goldie O'Gilt" per Rosa, which I find a rather unimaginative and boring name. In Dutch, however, her full name was once said to be Olivia Bladgoud (Olivia Goldleaf), which I find a great name.
I actually like the last name Rosa came up with for Goldie. But even in Rosa's work, you'd think "Glittering Goldie" would be a stage name. The other ballroom dancers who worked with Goldie went by what were clearly stage names (Glass-eye, Snake Hips, Lulu). So maybe Olivia Goldleaf could be her real name! (Barks had Scrooge always refer to her as Goldie in "Back to the Klondike", in the past and in the present, but that doesn't completely rule out it being a stage name that Scrooge still calls her by.)
In Greece, a lot of characters names have been changed so that they don't sound too weird in our language. And while most of these are pretty good, I hate the greek version of Kildare Coots name, which is Ducky Duck. Maybe it matches with his insane personality but I just find it too silly.
Also Mouseton in Greek is called "Mickey City", which is probably the laziest name of a fictional city in existence.
In Greece, a lot of characters names have been changed so that they don't sound too weird in our language. And while most of these are pretty good, I hate the greek version of Kildare Coots name, which is Ducky Duck. Maybe it matches with his insane personality but I just find it too silly.
Also Mouseton in Greek is called "Mickey City", which is probably the laziest name of a fictional city in existence.
Ooh, yes, Ducky Duck is indeed a poor choice. Even slightly worse than my least favorite English character name, Dickie Duck.
In my mental Duckworld, Dickie Duck is named Paperetta--she grew up in Italy. When she comes to Duckburg in the USA for college, her friends call her "Retta." I decided that her mother, Goldie's daughter, married an Italian and moved there to be with her husband, also a singer. Then Goldie asks Scrooge to look out for Paperetta when she comes to college in Duckburg, as a favor to an old friend. I've also made up names for Goldie's daughter and her husband, but I won't burden you with all that. But the fact that they live in Italy helps explain why they never appear, without having to make Paperetta yet another parentless character.
Also, in my mental Duckworld, Belle Duck is Belle Couac (her last name in French). One less Duck-surnamed character! And I've decided she's Cajun, hence the French name, which also extricates "Belle" from the "southern belle" meaning. I ignore the story with her first appearance, not written by Dick Kinney, which shows her in the past living in her father's southern mansion on a plantation, which has extremely unfortunate associations, even if slavery wasn't practiced anymore in her childhood.
Mickey City is like the city names in French: Donaldville, Mickeyville. I mean, really! The people who chose those names clearly weren't thinking about names that would make sense in-universe.
Ooh, yes, Ducky Duck is indeed a poor choice. Even slightly worse than my least favorite English character name, Dickie Duck.
I trust you know this, but I do want to point out the amusing coincidence that “Ducky” is actually a pretty direct translation of “Paperetta”, moreso than “Dickie”!
In my mental Duckworld, Dickie Duck is named Paperetta--she grew up in Italy. When she comes to Duckburg in the USA for college, her friends call her "Retta." I decided that her mother, Goldie's daughter, married an Italian and moved there to be with her husband, also a singer. Then Goldie asks Scrooge to look out for Paperetta when she comes to college in Duckburg, as a favor to an old friend. I've also made up names for Goldie's daughter and her husband, but I won't burden you with all that. But the fact that they live in Italy helps explain why they never appear, without having to make Paperetta yet another parentless character.
Neat! (Perhaps you'd mentioned this before, in which case I apologize for forgetting; been a bit of a stranger around here. If so trust I called it “neat” then, and I'm doing so again.) Personally, aside from the part of me that will always think of her as “Chris Yé-Yé”, I've grown to like the more subtle alteration to her official English name of having her go by “Dixie” — a female name, and one with musical associations to nod to the “Yè-Yè” of her original and French names. The idea of her growing up in Italy… would easily enter my headcanon if I saw it in a story, but doesn't feel quite real to me until then. But I like the spirit!
I agree she's definitely not parentless, at any rate, and I don't think I ever got the impression that she was. She just inhabits the same space as April, May and June — and if Daisy's sister can remain perpetually off-screen even though she lives in Duckburg, I find it easy enough to believe that we never met Paperetta/Dixie's parents even if they just live elsewhere in North America!
Mickey City is like the city names in French: Donaldville, Mickeyville. I mean, really! The people who chose those names clearly weren't thinking about names that would make sense in-universe.
As I think I've mentioned in the past, in defense of the French translators of yore, there was a point where Donald was to a very real degree used as Donald's last name as far as France was concerned; hence Grand-mère Donald for Grandma Duck, and Donald-Dingue for Ludwig. So conceivably, they were just running with America's “Duck family” being the “Donald family” in France, hence “Duck-burg” —> “Donald-ville”; I don't think it's an unreasonable assumption that Duckburg takes its name from the Duck Family in some way, even though Don Rosa elected to make into a coincidence. “Mickeyville” is less justifiable, but was probably named by analogy to the preexisting “Donaldville” just as “Mouseton” was coined late with “Duckburg” as a model — granting that we were stuck with Donaldville, wouldn't it have felt odd if Mickey's city failed to parallel it?
I actually like the last name Rosa came up with for Goldie. But even in Rosa's work, you'd think "Glittering Goldie" would be a stage name. The other ballroom dancers who worked with Goldie went by what were clearly stage names (Glass-eye, Snake Hips, Lulu). So maybe Olivia Goldleaf could be her real name!
I don't think that works, if you want to follow the letter of Rosa. In The King of the Klondike, we get a brief and entertaining glimpse of a pre-“glory” Goldie, who's not yet a glamorous performer, just the owner of a saloon. (Incidentally, I always liked this glimpse of a “casual” Goldie, wearing a ratty shirt and with her hair uncombed! Gives her a bit of depth, I think, a bit of reality.)
I suppose she could be living under an alias for whatever reason, but if she's just a proprietor-slash-bartender, it's unlikely that she'd already have come up with a “Snake-Hips”-style full-on stage-name. Indeed, the third panel's emphasis on “Glittering” implies that we're seeing a sneaky origin story for her actual stage name — Glittering Goldie, dropping the “O'Gilt” altogether, as Barks had it!
Now, it's still very possible that “Goldie” isn't the name on her birth certificate. Seems more like a nickname acquired due to her striking blond hair. Perhaps she is called Olivia. (Though actually, part of me wonders if she shouldn't have a name that feels absolutely wrong for Goldie — something long, old-fashioned, unglamorous — hence preferring to go by the “Goldie” nickname! Olivia is too much a name you could imagine her living by.)
But “O'Gilt” seems rather hard to construe as an alias. (And, for what it's worth, I like it! It's fun, if obvious, for Goldie to have an Irish heritage to match Scrooge's Scottishness. I wonder if we should imagine her as an immigrant too, though my gut says child of Irish immigrants, but born in America.)
Ooh, yes, Ducky Duck is indeed a poor choice. Even slightly worse than my least favorite English character name, Dickie Duck.
I trust you know this, but I do want to point out the amusing coincidence that “Ducky” is actually a pretty direct translation of “Paperetta”, moreso than “Dickie”!
In my mental Duckworld, Dickie Duck is named Paperetta--she grew up in Italy. When she comes to Duckburg in the USA for college, her friends call her "Retta." I decided that her mother, Goldie's daughter, married an Italian and moved there to be with her husband, also a singer. Then Goldie asks Scrooge to look out for Paperetta when she comes to college in Duckburg, as a favor to an old friend. I've also made up names for Goldie's daughter and her husband, but I won't burden you with all that. But the fact that they live in Italy helps explain why they never appear, without having to make Paperetta yet another parentless character.
Neat! (Perhaps you'd mentioned this before, in which case I apologize for forgetting; been a bit of a stranger around here. If so trust I called it “neat” then, and I'm doing so again.) Personally, aside from the part of me that will always think of her as “Chris Yé-Yé”, I've grown to like the more subtle alteration to her official English name of having her go by “Dixie” — a female name, and one with musical associations to nod to the “Yè-Yè” of her original and French names. The idea of her growing up in Italy… would easily enter my headcanon if I saw it in a story, but doesn't feel quite real to me until then. But I like the spirit!
I agree she's definitely not parentless, at any rate, and I don't think I ever got the impression that she was. She just inhabits the same space as April, May and June — and if Daisy's sister can remain perpetually off-screen even though she lives in Duckburg, I find it easy enough to believe that we never met Paperetta/Dixie's parents even if they just live elsewhere in North America!
Mickey City is like the city names in French: Donaldville, Mickeyville. I mean, really! The people who chose those names clearly weren't thinking about names that would make sense in-universe.
As I think I've mentioned in the past, in defense of the French translators of yore, there was a point where Donald was to a very real degree used as Donald's last name as far as France was concerned; hence Grand-mère Donald for Grandma Duck, and Donald-Dingue for Ludwig. So conceivably, they were just running with America's “Duck family” being the “Donald family” in France, hence “Duck-burg” —> “Donald-ville”; I don't think it's an unreasonable assumption that Duckburg takes its name from the Duck Family in some way, even though Don Rosa elected to make into a coincidence. “Mickeyville” is less justifiable, but was probably named by analogy to the preexisting “Donaldville” just as “Mouseton” was coined late with “Duckburg” as a model — granting that we were stuck with Donaldville, wouldn't it have felt odd if Mickey's city failed to parallel it?
Yup, I am aware that "Paperetta" means "little duck," so a more literal name-translation could have been "Ducky Yeah-Yeah"! And yes, that would have been way worse.
Sadly "Dixie" is a politicized word--as witness the recent name change of the band formerly known as the "Dixie Chicks." Due to the song expressing an enslaved man's homesickness for the plantation of his birth (see "Dixie (song)" on Wikipedia), a song which became known as the anthem of the South, the word "Dixie" was associated with the South in the Civil War. Since then, it has been used as a nickname for the Southeastern states, including by white Southerners themselves, but has also became associated with the myth of the Lost Cause and nostalgia for the good ol' days of slavery. Certainly it's used as a girl's name, but it's highly unlikely to be approved by Disney for a character. For headcanon purposes, though, I agree that it sounds significantly better than "Dickie Duck."
Glad you agree that Paperetta need not be parentless, just because her parents are never seen (or spoken of? AFAIK)! And yes, it could well be that they would never be seen even if they live elsewhere in the US, especially if Paperetta is in college. And especially if we're in the mid-20th century, before the era of the American helicopter parent! I put the parents in Italy partly to explain the name, I suppose, but one could chalk that up to an Italian father even if they live in Canada or the US. April, May and June are indeed in the same category in some parts of the Disney comics world. In the Netherlands, it's pretty clear that they live with Daisy full-time. E.g., they go off to school in the morning from Daisy's house. So one can't say that they're just staying with Daisy during school vacations or whatever. In the Netherlands, at least in Katrien, they're in the same state as Huey, Dewey and Louie, living full-time with a parent's sibling, and thus presumably parentless. (Of course, that doesn't stop the Dutch from publishing stories where Daisy seems to live alone, or where she can travel etc. without having to make arrangements for the girls. But to be fair, that sometimes happens with Donald as well, and one tends to just assume the boys are off at Junior Woodchucks camp!) In my mental Duckburg, however, they definitely live with their parents, Daisy's sister Rosa and her husband (Julio Malardez ), and just visit Daisy at times.
True, the use of "Donald" as more or less equivalent to a last name, as in "Grand-mère Donald," does put "Donaldville" in a different and more reasonable light. I take it all back.
Sadly "Dixie" is a politicized word--as witness the recent name change of the band formerly known as the "Dixie Chicks." Due to the song expressing an enslaved man's homesickness for the plantation of his birth (see "Dixie (song)" on Wikipedia), a song which became known as the anthem of the South, the word "Dixie" was associated with the South in the Civil War. Since then, it has been used as a nickname for the Southeastern states, including by white Southerners themselves, but has also became associated with the myth of the Lost Cause and nostalgia for the good ol' days of slavery. Certainly it's used as a girl's name, but it's highly unlikely to be approved by Disney for a character. For headcanon purposes, though, I agree that it sounds significantly better than "Dickie Duck."
Bugger. I wonder, do you have any other ideas for a name that's phonetically in the same realm as “Dickie”, but less incongruous or unwittingly-politically-charged-in-hindsight.
And what kind of a name IS Jubal Pomp, anyway? Is it a reference to anything?
"Despite his lack of appearance Scarpa gave him an American name, Jubal Cock. Cock is not a bad name per se as it describes his ancestry like Duck and Mouse in Donald Duck and Mickey Mouse: a grown-up male chicken. Unfortunately in English it is also a sexual reference and the Disney universe is completely free of anything related to sex. The name was therefore changed to Jubal Pomp."